MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Legal framework to restructure sovereign debts receives strong UN boost
The U.N. General Assembly approved this week the financing of a plan to develop a new legal framework to restructure national debts, a move aimed at avoiding the kind of speculative action that led Argentina to a second default. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesA welchers charter....
Dec 31st, 2014 - 08:34 am - Link - Report abuse 0Well done Argentina you've just cost millions of lives in the 3rd world.
Nobody will lend money to poor countries if the repayment is voluntary, and nobody will lend to Latin countries if the only come-back is based on honour.
ck and other syndicate members in the UN: Pay your f... debts! that´s the only legal framework to follow. all other framework is robbery. You can be sure to be robbed when ever a dictator is in the mood to stop payments to his creditors to save the money for his own pocket.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 08:57 am - Link - Report abuse 0i never again buy government bonds, never!
Depends what they come up with, but I bet your bottom dollar that the Developed Nations ( ie USA UK CANADA AUSTRALIA ) will probably not buy into the scheme as they would not be sure of getting their money back. The rate of return would have to be very high. And as @1 says CFK and her cronies have effectively killed of millions of poor people.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 10:30 am - Link - Report abuse 0@3 golfcronie,
Dec 31st, 2014 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0That would be the least of their worries.
CFK & co only care about themselves.
Nothing new here -- an organization of mostly deadbeat countries, trying to live off borrowed money (which they are unable, or unwilling to repay), votes for more ways to delay, or escape their responsibilities.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0Perceval said. “They're only motivated by profit,
Dec 31st, 2014 - 11:03 am - Link - Report abuse 0///////
perhaps they should go the USSR way,
barter and save billions,
and the only debt you will have to endure is a bag of potatoes, lol
mind you, if beef and soya can buy planes for the poor argies,
think what caviar would get you, an aircraft carrier perhaps...lol
how the world is changing [ for the worse ]
This should be fun to watch. I wonder if argieland realises that in the civilised world 'laws' aren't applied retrospectively. But let's look to the future. Will this committee do all its work by video link? Or will more politicians and 'experts' have to travel all over the world, at public expense, to attend meetings? Which countries will not bother to attend, thereby depriving the committee of vital intelligence and expertise? And this is only a resolution to establish a committee! How many years will it take to work out a legal framework? The decolonisation creeps have been at it for 53 years so far. And they still haven't got everything 'decolonised' because some people don't want it. And here we have a situation where around 50 countries may vote against the 'legal framework' when it is put forward. And it can't be forced on anyone! Anyone want to guess which countries will decline to implement it? Think back. When argieland needed to sell its bonds, it had to give up its sovereign immunity to persuade people to buy. Therefore, the first move will be that 'investors' will demand that the UN 'legal framework' is specifically excluded as a method of restructuring. If the hopeful borrower refuses, nobody will lend. I wonder what the costs are of printing up a bond issue that nobody will buy? Perhaps 'investors' will demand hugely punitive penalties just for the 'borrower' to rely on the 'legal framework'.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 11:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0And everybody will be aware that this being pushed by argieland. In preparation for its next default. It's such a stupid country. If this was being presented by a country that never or rarely defaults, it would be different. But argieland isn't just a regular defaulter, it's a regular, corrupt, criminal defaulter.
The UN Resolution is also a good information for potential creditors.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 11:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0After this UN vote, potential creditors now know, which 119 countries, like Argentina, do not want to repay their debts.
Who will lend these 119 countries in future money?
It doesn't matter and it won't change the way bond contracts are written. Its pure political nonsense.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 12:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Surely if one cant pay ones debts,
Dec 31st, 2014 - 01:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0then one should not be allowed to borrow.
Only 9 hrs till Argentina pays it debts with no excuses
Dec 31st, 2014 - 03:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“They're only motivated by profit, . . . ”
Dec 31st, 2014 - 04:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Are you sure? Have you ever heard of equity? Fairness? The rule of law?
Would you have anarchy?
The rotting roadkillian perronistas are motivated only by political expediency and have no honor.
The red herring RUFO is kaput in 13 hours. Will rotting roadkill henceforth bargain in good faith? lol
Are all the Argentinian Ambassadors female?, comon Argentinian men grow so balls and be men, or aren't there any with balls.
Dec 31st, 2014 - 07:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Should Canada just be declared an enemy of Argentina at this point? I think they even voted against Argentina for something in the Pan American Olympic committee... I think its time to kick the f--- off all Canadians from Argentina.
Jan 01st, 2015 - 01:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0@14 They were not voting against ARGENTINA.
Jan 01st, 2015 - 11:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0You are a typical Argie, you have no idea of “ DEMOCRACY ” do you? If you don't like something you vote against it, it is NOT voting against the Government it is voting against the subject of the vote. You seem to think like most Argies that dissent is all about treason. No wonder your country is so fucked up you have had too many Military Governments and Dictators. And I hasten to add still have. All your judiciary and polititians are all hand picked and if dissent is voiced from either they are dismissed. They are all like little children in Government each side accusing the other of nefarious acts, fucking grow some balls and sort it.
14# “Should Canada just be declared an enemy of Argentina at this point? I think they even voted against Argentina for something in the Pan American Olympic committee... I think its time to kick the f--- off all Canadians from Argentina.”
Jan 01st, 2015 - 11:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0Canada is part of America, your government is always carrying on about American solidarity etc, etc.....
One big diffence is that Canada is an important, influential member of the community whereas Argentine is just a failed state inhabited by a bunch of nobodies!
But Argentina might as well declare Canada an 'enemy of Argentina' you government is doing its best to make enemies of most countries that matter.
@14. Hilarious! “an enemy of Argentina”? Everybody is an enemy of argieland! There are a few states that pretend 'temporarily' to be friendly and supportive. Meanwhile, Iran needs certain supplies. Argieland provides them in return for nothing much. North Korea probably sees an opportunity to set up similar facilities to those Russia tried to achieve in Cuba. Russia wants bases. Who suffers because Russia wanted bases in Ukraine and a 'presence' in Cuba? And China? China has figured out that it doesn't need to conquer the world militarily, when it can do it commercially. Of course civilised states will respond 'appropriately'. The US, UK and Canada may decide to 'neutralise' the threat. China, Iran, North Korea and Russia may decide to respond. And so argieland will have 'improved' on its past performance. Not satisfied with having started the Falkland Islands, argieland will start World War 3! Conveniently forgetting, until it's too late, that argieland will be destroyed. Millions will die. Perhaps the world will wake up in time and stop once argieland has been destroyed. Perhaps every nuclear nation will launch on argieland. Canada has more friends and is more important than argieland. The Commonwealth may be mobilised. 53 nations providing military musclepower. And when it's over, after about 5 days, there will be suggestions that any remaining argies, as punishment for their many crimes, should just be enslaved. Classified on the same level as donkeys and asses. Beasts of burden. Replacements for tractors. 'Workers' to dig out radioactive soil. Argies finally find their proper level.
Jan 01st, 2015 - 12:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0See what you've done?
Stop it Conqueror, l can't stop laughing.
Jan 01st, 2015 - 12:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0See what you've done? lol!
17. There's not enough silica present to just glass it over - thereby capping it?
Jan 01st, 2015 - 09:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 09. You hit it right on the head, the UN doesn't loan money, and doesn't dictate terms for the loan, the bond underwriters do. No bondholder would buy bonds if they were going to be screwed later by a politically skewed panel filled with SA cronies.. Look how bad Argentinas bond issue flopped when issued under argentine law just recently..
Jan 01st, 2015 - 10:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#17
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 07:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0Wow. This delirious comment really shows the fantasies of a despondent member of colonizer countries who, like Briton on #6, hopelessly see “how the world is changing-for the worse.”
But let's take another look at the story:
“ The 193-member world body voted 119-15 with 35 abstentions in favor of a resolution outlining the plan.”
The moved aims at “avoiding the kind of speculative action that led Argentina to a second default.”
Wow. If this is not massive support against vulture practices I do not know what it is.
Indeed, the United States, Britain and Canada among others did all in their power to prevent money being allocated to the committee in charge of drafting the legislation. This shows their governments' support of the parasitical practices of the vultures.
Let's remember the vultures are opportunistic financiers who buy sovereign debt bonds when countries are financially down to their knees and then using the courts to recover 100 per cent of the junk bonds' face value when those countries are in recovery, making phenomenal gains in the process.
This vote is nothing but another triumph for Argentina and developing countries, and a new stinging defeat for the vultures and the countries that support them.
Financier Paul Singer will likely regret having tried to sink his teeth into the tough Argentine bone. After mercilessly pulling millions from impoverished countries such as Peru or Liberia, the scheme is not working, even with the help of diligent NY Judge Thomas Griesa.
Nobody is foolish to believe this new legislation will apply to the current vulture affair. Argentina is just attempting to prevent future schemes of the same sort.
You're right Briton. The world ain't what it used to be.
It will take many years to come up with legislation, and when it does will the creditors that will look at it critically say “ No. not worth it ” and millions of poor people will die of a result. Is that what you want? The time has come if you borrow money in “ good faith ” you give it back in “ good faith ”. Most creditors will keep an eye on Argentina as a “ serial debtor ” not the sort of advertisement you want when you want money.
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 10:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0@21. What's wrong with 'delirious' on New Year's Day? Why would I be despondent? Argieland still has massive debts. None of its jiggling, finagling , wriggling or just plain lying has changed it. Except that the debts, taking into account interest and penalties, will be larger. You want 'delirious'? Research the policies the argie government adopts and the decisions it takes all year long. One day for us, 365 for the argie government!
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 11:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0You see this as a triumph for argieland? What it is has already been pointed out. It will identify the highest risk countries. Those most likely to default and then try to renege. It will be a welchers' charter. But I suppose we can thank argieland in one respect. People will look at the countries that have voted against this and won't subscribe to it and compare that to their record for repaying their debts. They will see that those countries ALWAYS repay their debts. It may take them many years but they do it. And they don't whinge and whine and try to evade both their responsibilities and/or the law. Look at argieland. It's down to the level of arguing about the meaning of words. It's so stupid that, having relinquished its sovereign immunity in order to persuade people to buy the bonds, it's tried to claim sovereign immunity. So thanks, argieland, 119 countries that are now going to find it harder to borrow money. 119 countries where interest rates/dividends will have to be higher. And, as Monkeymagic points out, how many millions will die as a result? Argieland displaying its usual selfishness! Or its inability to think beyond tomorrow. As the proposer of this measure, argieland is going to regret this. And then it will be someone else's fault!
21#
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 01:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, let’s look at the story again. Some of Argentina’s creditors (the holdouts’) refused to accept Argentina’s unreasonable take it or leave it offer and held out for full repayment of the loans- as they are perfectly entitled to do. This decision has now been validated by a US court.
Argentina’s response to the legal ruling was to demonise the holdouts as being ‘vultures’, attack the reputation of the US legal system in general and the judge in particular, play the victim card and, of course, take its grievances to the UN. They have now persuaded the GA to agree to the financing of a plan to develop a new legal framework to restructure national debts. It would appear that the UN GA and Argentina are good at wasting money – other people’s money of course.
When the UN draft resolution was adopted, the representative of the US said that it: “would establish a mandate for an expensive U.N. process to address issues that are already being dealt with in other international institutions” including the IMF …”
Therefore, the proposed financing plan is an expensive, unnecessary layer of bureracy that will make it harder for poorer countries to secure development loans on reasonable terms. For the Argentine Ambassador to the UN to claim that the proposed plan “is not for Argentina but for developing countries..” is rank hypocrisy. Just as it always does when it can’t get its way, Argentina’s approach to the UN was an attempt to justify its avoidance actions in the eyes of the world and find an excuse not to pay its debts.
But you are right about one aspect, the world is changing, in favour of creditors, from now on creditors are going to be much more circumspect about lending money to economic basket cases, thanks to Argentina’s failure to meet its obligations and attempt to use UN GA resolutions to subvert the established financial system.
I'm not an economist, I don't pretend to be but it seems obvious to me that if a country, let's call it Roadkillia, approaches a bank, lets call it BoA, saying ”we want to borrow 1 squillion dollars to develop some guano reserves but under the rules promulgated by some fairyland organisation (let's call it the 'UN') and not your t & c's“, then the first thing that BoA is going to say is ”because of your appalling credit history and because we think the UN rules are tosh we are unable to help you but here is the web address of Wonga”.
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 01:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps the UN needfs to go into the financing business being that they are trying to create rules to finance by. Then, let them access the countries who will borrow from the UN under those rules.
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 04:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@21
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 05:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Look at it another way.
Imagine you are a bank. Imagine that you have loaned 1 million people some money. Imagine that you then ask the 1 million whether they should have to repay the money you loaned them?
During the vote you can point out how rich the bank is, and how poor the debtors are...
What do you think the result would be?
However, more importantly, what do you think the answer will be next time you want to borrow?
This is not a victory, it is suicide....oh well never mind.
The poor who want everything free will always expect handouts and teach their citizens that same. The poor will now only get poorer.
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Singerlandia. That kind of has a nice ring to it!
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The more we all read the replies of these intelligent very sophisticated advanced fully educated argentines, one has to wonder if all of us, yes, all 199 odd nations of this world, have been to hard on her, perhaps we have misunderstood or underestimated her,
Jan 02nd, 2015 - 08:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Perhaps argentina was and is correct, and the world would be betterof controlled by CFK via argentina, and we are all just enviouse and jelouse of this great advanced powerfull kind energetic honourable country,
Then again, new year, hang over and still confused, we all make mistakes,
Perhaps when we all get sobered up, it was all a dream, and the old hag still plays the victim….lolol
.
@14 CC
Jan 03rd, 2015 - 04:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Should Canada just be declared an enemy of Argentina at this point?”
You couldn't even take the Falklands properly so I don't fancy your chances of invading Canada.
Oh yes and Canada don't throw a hissy fit at Pierre st Miquelon belonging to France.
If Argentina starts making everybody its enemy,
Jan 04th, 2015 - 07:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0their does this leave [[ the world supports us crap ]]
@32 Briton,
Jan 04th, 2015 - 09:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The World supports the idea that Argentina pays their debts & stops moaning about some islands that have never been theirs & never will be.
Agreed..
Jan 04th, 2015 - 11:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#24
Jan 05th, 2015 - 02:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0Downunder and other writers in this board seem to be at lost over what the heck is happening in Argentina and why on earth most nations are lending it their support.
They suddenly seem to be worried about other poor developing countries and all the kids that are going to die there because Argentina is going to make it more difficult to borrow.
Hogwash.
Firstly, for the first time Argentina has a government that looks after the country's interests instead of those of large multinationals and their local lackeys. So get used to the new reality: the times where Argentine envoys went to the U.S. or Europe hat in hand are over.
Secondly, don't break my heart with your scenes of naive financiers coming to help orphans and then being fooled by nasty gauchos. Most, if not all lending to developing countries is only to the benefit of large corporations and financial entities. Often, the money never reaches the country but is directed to pay contracts whose fruits the country never sees. Of course the local lackeys get rich in the process. Once a country has been conveniently indebted, all new borrowing is used to “refinance” debt, in an infernal, never-ending downward cycle.
In fact, what is being attempted with the anti-vulture international legislation is not to allow a free-for-all as some indignant writers here argue. It's just to prevent the excesses of greedy financiers who will stop at nothing pressing the lemon till last drop. Look at the European mess today.
Most Argentina creditors understood they had to let the country room to breath in order to get part of their money back; the vultures are a different beast.
And to those who like to lay blame on the much-maligned Kirchners: stop conveniently forgetting that it wasn't Néstor nor Cristina who borrowed like crazy and it was not them who declared default; they rather have been picking up the pieces and bringing the country back to life while making large, timely payments to most creditors.
@35 Enrique Massot,
Jan 05th, 2015 - 06:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0Of course not, enrique.
lt was not Argentina's fault.
We ALL KNOW that!
lt is NEVER Argentina's fault.
Argentina is ALWAYS the victim.
Poor, poor Argentina,
(sung to “poor, poor Evangeline” with muted violins fading out).
@35
Jan 05th, 2015 - 07:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0“....what the heck is happening in Argentina and why on earth most nations are lending it their support.”
Well then, Argentina should approach 'most nations who are lending it their support' and apply for loans directly from them. They will, no doubt, fall over themselves to lend Argentina more money in the knowledge that it will probably never be repaid.
“while making large, timely payments to most creditors.”
”Large timely payments to most creditors” Large payments, afterthe haircut the creditors took so that they could get something? But they have had the ‘privilege’ of being screwed over by Argentina; I bet they feel good about that!
You people are delusional!
And yet,
Jan 05th, 2015 - 10:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0if countries owed Argentina millions,
you can bet your bottom dollar that CFK would be demanding it back.
“excesses of greedy financiers”
Jan 05th, 2015 - 10:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0I don't think these social commies will ever understand the concept of risk/reward. Who ever said financiers care about your poor or hungry children? You think the auto manufacturers do? Because they are operating under the same premise as the financiers.....to make money. But no need to worry because soon enough......The international corporations that you so hate will all be out of SA. I think you better take a damn good and hard look of just how many there are in SA.......and the flights they are leaving on.
I say if the UN wants to play financier.........start assessing amounts to finance. The countries who actually lend money will not sign on to actually the manage to arrive at......in 3, 5 or 10 years....if they ever do. And if they do........we'll see if the signatory countries manage to borrow funds again.
Austal Elvis is offering aU$ bonds at 18% yoy return. I guess that's what happens when you don't pay your bills.
Jan 05th, 2015 - 05:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0My guess is they'll have a hard time selling them too!
Bahahahaha
Argentina reminds us , on one hand , a child=I want I want all the time,
Jan 05th, 2015 - 07:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0and on the other hand, and bad tempered nasty tenant,
Wont pay wont pay.
The trolls are weakened. Must be the moon phase. (Or Max's camper fund is running short.)
Jan 06th, 2015 - 03:23 am - Link - Report abuse 0S M A E G O L !
The trolls are leaving this blog in droves...lol
Jan 06th, 2015 - 08:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@7 Conqueror “But Argieland...it´s a regular, corrupt, criminal defaulter”.
Jan 06th, 2015 - 10:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What it has never been it´s a regular, corrupt, criminal PIRATE.
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