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Fears in Europe of violent retaliation and Islamophobia following Paris killings

Thursday, January 8th 2015 - 05:21 UTC
Full article 360 comments

The terror attack that killed 12 people in Paris on Wednesday will have come as little surprise to Europe's police and intelligence services. For months, they've regarded the prospect of a mass killing in Europe by isolated gunmen or small groups of Islamist terrorists as a question of when rather than if. Read full article

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  • Heisenbergcontext

    Je Suis Charlie.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:56 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DerkeBlake

    @1 Heisenbergcontext

    Well put.

    Is Islamophobia by definition just an irrational paranoia; an anxiety disorder? Maybe not. Maybe it's just good thinking; a survival instinct.

    As the saying goes, it (Islam) is what it is, not what it's suppose (or was originally meant) to be. Until the moderates in this faith can rein in the extremists in their midst, on their own, it will be interpreted by the rest of society for what it currently presents.

    Queue the talking heads, telling us that these killers weren't real Muslims, and this had nothing to do with Islam. And the Imans praising them with faint condemnation. Please don't tell me that this has nothing to do with Islam. I'm sick of that rerun.
    These so-call moderates, in any other monolithic religion, would be considered extremist. It's simply the nature of the beast. I for one will take them exactly at their word (they aren't liars), that they did it in the name of Islam; and whether it's a perversion is actually irrelevant at this point.

    We are all Charlie.

    I'm actually a humanist. I have never written a single hateful sentence directed at any identifiable group or person ever on the site (or any other); but I have no doubt but what I'm a bigot in some minds.

    Derke

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 06:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • EscoSes Doido

    Religion in general is bad for humanity in this day and age.

    Islam is a particularly rabid form, which is very vulnerable to the most violent interpretation by its followers.

    (and I'm being very generous with that statement)

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 06:38 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DerkeBlake

    @3 EscoSes Doido

    Yes, my thoughts exactly. You just managed to convey it much more cleanly, concisely and effectively.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 06:51 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    When are western Governments going to stop pussyfooting around & get real with these people?
    Are we seeing the appeasement of the 1930's raising its lily-liveried head again?
    We all know how that turned out.
    Where are the politicians & do-gooders, who advocated muslim immigration, now?
    All in hiding with their pensions?
    They should be strung up as traitors.
    Every crime that a radical muslim commits, in the name of their religion, can be laid at these people's door.
    The experiment failed, people.
    Clear the decks for action & move on.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 09:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    Being a humanist is simply abdicating your responsibility to the human race.

    Are the perpetrators of this dreadful crime human? I do not think so and they have abdicated their right to live in the modern world.

    Kill them all before they kill us, you KNOW it will come to it sooner or later so do it now before they kill even more of us.

    Religion is the pestilence of humanity, it needs to be dealt with, and no matter what variety it calls itself.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Stevie

    Repudious act, as any act where civilians get murdered.
    Regardless of the origin, religion or political belief of the murderer.

    In order to call yourself humanists, you need to care for the human race, not your own interests only.

    Repudious...

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • SebaSvtz

    This is a lost war.

    We are trying to be tolerant and nice with people who want to destroy our tolerant western societies to impose their barbaric believes.

    They know we are extremely afraid to call them for their proper name: barbaric murderous. They know we would die before saying `stop´to islamism.

    This is a lost war, unless we all wake up as soon as possible and stand up, for once and for all, against them.

    Enough of all these PC BS. Islamism IS a threat to our world and to all the freedoms we have achieve through years (centuries) of struggle, suffering and sacrifice. Millions died in the XX century fighting against totalitarian regimes. We MUST NOT surrender to the new form of extremism (islamism) just to be `nice´and `tolerant´.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    They were veterans of the Syrian civil war, well trained, well planned, they used RPG's & AK-47, executed the policemen on the watch and then proceeded to kill the journalist for half an hour after they made their escape. Shouting ”Allahu akbar, the profet has being avenged!

    Its very hard for the politically correct Mr Nice guy to say the ware just losers amateurs not a terrorist attack and that Islam has nothing to do with it, like happaned in Ottowa and Sydney

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:25 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Ira Curtis

    How come nobody blames Israel?
    Will this serve as a wakeup call? No, I don't think so.
    Things are what they are, not what they suppose to be. So please cut the BS
    My Muslim neighbor prays five times a day but is drunk the rest of the time.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    10 “How come nobody blames Israel?
    Will this serve as a wakeup call? No, I don't think so.”

    You are an idiot, Sir. Picking on the only western nation that actually has the balls to do what you as a people and country fail to do.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Conqueror

    There ARE ways to stop this. Step 1. Arm the populace. Step 2. Shoot to kill is acceptable, although shoot to disable to preserve the animal for torture is preferred. Step 3. Any form of torture should be permissible in order to obtain accurate information. For instance, cutting off a finger or toe with a hacksaw should be fine. Followed by cutting of another if the information turns out to be false. Torture should cease once the animal has no fingers or toes, no hands or feet, no legs or arms, no genitalia of any description, no nose, only one and only one ear. And, at the last, no tongue. Not forgetting the electric 'stimulation'. Step 4. Then comes the execution. Undertaken in public with what is left of the animal naked. First steps are to remove sexual organs of any description. Slowly. With a ripsaw. Then the actual death. The loop of rope. None of those silly hangman's knots. Just a simple slip knot. Placed to throttle. And the steel stake positioned to receive the ass. No quick demise. No tug on the ankles. Perhaps 8 hours to die? Choked and speared. Perhaps another rope could be secured under the armpits. Just so that the animal could be lifted up. And then dropped back. Step 5. Everything should be recorded on video. Broadcast by television once faces have been obscured.
    The messages to be passed on to the other animals to be that there will be no mercy, for one hundred years, animals can be killed on sight, that we can copy barbarism without a problem, that we will defend ourselves.

    Most importantly, no muslims should be permitted in Christian/Western countries. Forget 'nationality' or 'citizenship'. If you're muslim, you're out of wherever. It should be impossible to commit a crime against a muslim. Robbery, theft, assault, rape, murder. All natural actions against muslims. Perhaps regular ferry voyages to the southern Mediterranean to dump the corpses. Washed up on the North African coast, it should send a message! Stay away!

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 12:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • yankeeboy

    I've long thought that France would be the wrong place for Muslims to cause trouble. The French, although they profess tolerance acceptance etc. in reality do not. They are and will be brutal to these people. Then it will spread to Germany.
    Then Nordic and the rest of the EU countries.
    The muslims are not integrating into society anywhere but in the USA. They keep to their barbaric traditions, they keep to a ghetto, they don't learn the language and live mostly off the gov't benefits.
    This may be the start of the pogrom to get rid of them within the EU.
    Wait and see

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    There's nothing would please Islamofucks more than for Islamophobes to give them the religious war they want to believe is already happening.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 12:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Klingon

    Hows that assimilation and apeasement working out?
    There liberal immigration policy is to blame for this tragedy.
    For every attack they need to burn the mosques where ever these animals preyed.
    But alas they will water it down to “Socially marginilzed individuals ”and give the Muslims more benefits.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    The main journals of the USA refused to publish the cartoons AFTER the attacks, they pixelled them. The media is already retreating, Charlie Hebdo had all the attention focused on them as they were the only ones with the courage to publish them.

    http://video.foxnews.com/v/3976684425001/mark-steyn-charlie-hebdo-cartoonists-were-brave/?#sp=show-clips

    This happened in the suburbs of Paris 10 years ago, the Iraq invasion was still fresh and Chirac had in fact refused to join the US-UK-Spain coalition in 2003…. So why where the Muslims already revolting in France?? The problem it was all swept under the carpet and the French Euro elites kept on looking the other way. France is in a greater stage of infestation of Muslims than the UK is who have more then 10% of their school kids already Muslim.
    If the Europeans don’t do something about it soon and drastic they are history.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 01:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @14 I completely agree. How easily people are manipulated by the very people they profess to hate.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 01:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    CD2 is still repeating exagerated bogus statistics. His comments therefore cannot be taken seriously. This slewed misinformation doesnt help. Its designed (by Gollum probably) to make Brits feel bad and stoke hate. We aint buying it…

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 01:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rick from Maryland

    Islamophobia.... An irrational fear.

    Silly Frenchies just suffering with a “phobia”...

    Not to worry... The Islamists have a cure.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 01:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • yankeeboy

    Islamophobes? Puhleeez!! These are barbaric tribal beings still living in the middle ages.
    You need to expel or kill by their tribes.
    Then they'll learn.
    If they want a war they'll be on the losing side of it.
    I have no moral trouble turning the whole mideast into glass.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 01:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    18

    7 million students in public schools+ 600 K private schools

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10514615/School-population-to-grow-by-one-million-to-40-year-high.html

    750 K Muslims from ages 5-19 according to the UK Census 2011. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10514615/School-population-to-grow-by-one-million-to-40-year-high.html

    Do the maths

    10% British pupils are Muslim as none other than the Guardian says http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10514615/School-population-to-grow-by-one-million-to-40-year-high.html

    Almost a tenth of babies and toddlers in England and Wales are Muslim, census figures show
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10514615/School-population-to-grow-by-one-million-to-40-year-high.html

    What I find really amusing with all you liberals is that you keep on saying its only a fringe minority of extremist, its all OK, don’t get alarmed, don’t hurt anyones sensibilities but when the numbers & facts show up you come up with your kool aid and your own wishful thinking and brush the truth aside just because I’m argentine. Gollum..... Or Timerman the guy that signed in Abbis Ababa the literal claudication to Iran and the betrayal of the AMIA victims is going to invent this stuff just to annoy you..

    You are a Kool aid retard, Captain Silver who has his head so deep up your own arse, I cant tell if you are talking or if you are farting.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 02:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    Islamic extremists deserve the full force of of retribution but don't lump all Muslims in with them.

    Take a look at history and see if any religion has not suffered from extremist elements. You won't have to look very hard.

    Let us try not to forget that 12 people died yesterday just because they believed that all religions should be held up to scrutiny and criticism if we are to uphold the right to free speech in our democracies. They didn't mock muslims or the prophet Muhammad, they quite rightly highlighted the ridiculous ideology of Islamic extremists.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 02:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    We still aint buying it… you can try and try to stoke up hate but it wont work. Why? Because we live here and we know whats what and you dont. As to having heads up arses who has their head up you? You can only look on and daily exhibit your ignorance and jealousy.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 02:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Stevie

    Finally some proper humanism...

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 02:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    23. Cut the crap you where just owned 100%

    And many, many, many more Europeans say otherwise than a couple of liberal twats of MercoPress… You aint buying the truth and the statistics because you are a retard in denial or a coward and nothing else.... Just like Ks retards ignore and deny the reality regarding poverty inflation and so on.


    Push your head futher up into “lala la land” and you may actually get to your stomach and burn & die of acidity.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 02:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    Lennon was correct Religion is the source of almost all of the worlds strife, the rest is nationalism or tribalism as demonstrated in Argentinas sad case. Unfortunately no-one is ever going to stop that because there will always be adherents who believe in an extreme version of their particular faith. Its just an excuse and outlet for hate and violence that exists within some people, particularly those who have been damaged in some way in childhood. Fortunately western society is strong enough to withstand the onslaught. The wealth of Europe and North America is a draw to everyone in the third world who wants a better life and immigration to European and North Merican nations will inevitably continue. I think that what Britain is just starting to do, stating our British values and educating all citizens about them is the right way to create mutual respect and coexistence in cohesive society. The hate and bile spouted by the various trolls here as agents provocateurs demonstrate clearly the backward attitudes that must be resisted. The assasins used guns, these idiots try to use hate. Both are as bad as the other.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Bahahahaha. #25 You can always identify the one that lost the argument when they resort to pathetic insults! :-)))

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Orbit

    “One must state it plainly. Religion comes from the period of human prehistory where nobody—not even the mighty Democritus who concluded that all matter was made from atoms—had the smallest idea what was going on. It comes from the bawling and fearful infancy of our species, and is a babyish attempt to meet our inescapable demand for knowledge (as well as for comfort, reassurance and other infantile needs). Today the least educated of my children knows much more about the natural order than any of the founders of religion, and one would like to think—though the connection is not a fully demonstrable one—that this is why they seem so uninterested in sending fellow humans to hell.”

    “The Bible may, indeed does, contain a warrant for trafficking in humans, for ethnic cleansing, for slavery, for bride-price, and for indiscriminate massacre, but we are not bound by any of it because it was put together by crude, uncultured human mammals.”

    ”The person who is certain, and who claims divine warrant for his certainty, belongs now to the infancy of our species.”

    ― Christopher Hitchens, God is Not Great: How Religion Poisons Everything

    Amen

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • brucey-babe

    Until the moderate muslims come out in their millions with placards saying “Not in my name”, then sorry I can only assume they all have one outlook, 'Kill the Christians '

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    27.

    LOL You can’t get a more pathetic desperate owned reply than that!!

    Do you know how to debate in Britain any longer???
    The one who wins an argument is the one who proves who is right and stands up by his claims. I said 10% of all UK kids where Muslim, you didn't like the truth you decided to insult me based on crap and that I’m Argentine, you didn’t even look it up. You base line argument was “Im British, I live here, you are argentine so you are wrong” I produced all the evidence and the sources needed to back my claims and that is why I'm right, and you got your arse owned….

    After winning, if I choose to insult you and claim that you are a retarded liberal with his head up his own arse that declines to see the truth in front of him is because I really think you are one. I have a right to treat you like Scum for being an arsehole.

    ---------------------------------------------------------

    Ben Shapiro: The Myth of the Tiny Radical Muslim Minority
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7TAAw3oQvg

    If I had to make a business decision with the chances of say 70% failure or marry somebody with divorce rates of 70% ... you would not call me a smart guy would you??

    That is perhaps the ammount of Sharia worshipers in the entire Muslim world.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Klingon

    Fact: If they had not of let them in first place France would not be in this position.

    We don't see Muslims attacking Port Stanley do we? Why? because I venture to say there are none there.

    The Liberals will cause more death and destruction due to their tolerance and unwillingness to be seen as politically uncorrect.
    France needs to bulldoze the slums and send them back to there desert hole.

    https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t34.0-12/10904114_831663080209807_1363728197_n.jpg?oh=c77f7f0d09e0843cc83e69db34184949&oe=54B0D92D&__gda__=1420851469_e30b2f638efa493a1a5b47b47c9675d4

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 03:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    #31 Sounds like a solution adopted by the Nazis. Didnt work for them did it? Simplistic solutions based on hate bring out the worst in societies and ultimately fail.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    31.
    The liberals are more dangerous than the Muslims... The Muslims only understand the language that is spoken from the barrel of a gun. They can be defeated and expelled as they were in Poitiers, Lepanto, Malta or Vienna.
    Liberals control the media, they control the Western State, they make the laws, they spy on everyone to be on touch about who sais anything that might sound offensive and start a clash. The West is becoming the Orewellian state. All in all France and European countries have burned itself with a massive State that burdens its citizens with taxes. Having kids is expensive, women want to work and have a carrier 20 boyfriends and “enjoy life”, the result is few and fewer have kids and birth rates collapsed since the sex revolution, feminism and Welfare State.... Who is going to pay for the elderly Europeans retirement?? They are already indebted. That is why they imported so much scum... The politicians didn't do it because they are retarded traitors. They just defend their own system they created to control power.

    Those are far more dangerous than the Muslims. The French need to take those Guilloteens out of the Museaums and start rolling some heads.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Heisenbergcontext

    I express my solidarity with the victims of this crime for their courage and for their work, being the most recent inheritors of what Voltaire began.It doesn't mean I am instantly going to dishonour the memory of the many positive experiences I've had in the company of Muslim neighbours and colleagues. Honest people all.

    @28 Orbit

    Christopher Hitchens was a great writer and a very smart man, but often not a wise one, and that extract is a prime example. It is almost laughably ignorant and intellectually dishonest. There's a context for everything and ignoring the context in which the Bible was composed is such an egregious omission for a journalist it makes me shake my head in disbelief.

    I'll let Voltaire have the last word: “Faith consists in believing when it is beyond the power of reason to believe”.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Mendoza Canadian

    28 and 29: right on. I knew and worked with Muslims in Canada and they were fine people. But, it seems that the world has gone a bit tipsy and it is time for ALL people to stand up for their rights, especially their right to free speech. Sending some of these nut cases back to the lands they came from where there is no freedom of anything might just teach them a few lessons.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Argentina welcomed and nurtured fleeing Nazis. Some descendents and adherents are obviously alive and well. Another reason to shun the dark country. Argyland is reckoned to be one of the most intolerant and racist places on the planet, populated by incompetent basket cases incapable of running their own affairs! Fling another nun…

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DerkeBlake

    Empirically, relative to the context of modern society, “moderate Muslim” is proving itself to be a contradiction in terms; or at the very least recherche . The last label that anyone could ever have pinned on me is that of a fear monger; but this crap is getting the better of me. Barbaric fideism.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bV710c1dgpU (two mins in)

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    36.
    Fact check: Peron welcomed and nurtured fleeing Nazis, secretely behind everyones backs and we found about it more than 40 years later.... You support and nuture Islamo Nazi them willingly and with your concent.

    Some descendents and adherents of Neville Chamberlain are obviously alive and well........

    @37
    Statistics, opinion polls even the words of the clerics... nothing is going to convince the liberals that there is no such thing as a moderate Muslim.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Heisenbergcontext

    Just to go on, because I can't stop thinking about it...it's easy to confuse religion and church. They are not the same thing at all. ALL institutions where power is concentrated in the hands of the few are dangerous and exploitative. The Nazi Party being an obvious example. Religion is at it's heart simply about a relationship between a human and a power they consider greater than them. Humility in other words.

    It's really about feelings. If you listen to Al Green or the The Staple Singers you can hear how that sounds. Gratitude for being alive. And that feeling can be traced back to their ancestors, the slaves who were told that God loves you too, that you are equal in His eyes and their devotion would be rewarded.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 04:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 34 Heisenbergcontext
    “I'll let Voltaire have the last word: “Faith consists in believing when it is beyond the power of reason to believe”.”

    Voltaire was born in 1694.

    There were lots of things that were unknown then that we know now: I think we have moved on in 321 years.

    Or do you believe in fairies at the bottom of your garden?

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    #36 It wasnt Argies that welcomed Nazis, it was Peron lol! Argies just keep giving dont they? It wasnt us all celebrating in the Plaza when we invaded the Falklands, it wasnt us that threw Nuns out of Aeroplanes, it wasnt us that disappeared all those opponents, it wasnt us that killed all those Indians in Patagonia. Nothing changes! All indefensible. Britain did plenty of indefensible things, even quite recently, but you will find few Britons defending them. Thats the difference. And that is why people want to come here, they like our values as well as our enterprise, wealth, safe environment, tolerance and fairness , things you Argie nincompoops deride. Thats why your country is a serial basketcase and will never recover. You can look forward to only more of the same for the rest of your miserable lives.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    41.
    Pfff....shut up bitch.

    Argentina is the least of your problems, and you know it. Your grandchildren of the Caliphate will be begging our embassies to let them in. Sure in hell, throwing people off planes and taking folks fora ride in a Green Falcon stopped communism in Argentina for 20 years. And after the Desert campaign no more Indian raids ever came to be. It’s a tough world, and nations that survived didn’t do so by applying PC BS that you spout against the enemies that wished to destroy them.

    Argentines are not killing and indoctrinating people in Europe. Argentines are not bombing and massacring journalists for publishing cartoons Malvinistas are not infiltrating British schools i.e “Trojan Horse” to teach them that the Malvinas are Argentinas, Argies are not setting Malvinista patrols and telling women what to wear and what to do in the British streets.

    You have to be A REALLY STUPID RETARDED DEFLECTIVE FOOL to be a Brit complaining in MercoPress about the lunatics that run Argentina, losers that can’t even organize a piss up in a brewery being a problem when you are at WAR in your own backyard and you face extinction..

    Just the few days ao trying to make it across another retard like yourself, that as the younger generations come along the more % of Muslims they have. The proportion of 0-4 Year olds in the UK Muslim community is higher than in the West Bank!!! That is truly amazing; they are in a declared demographic war with Israel but with a huge wall between them.

    This is what was being published in your own media, your government is trying to make the nursery teachers spy on

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @38

    Yeah, but that's not all. What about the Italians? They're all in the Mafia, you know. You ask me, after we burn down the curry houses we oughtta start on the pizzerias. You can't be too sure after all. And the Chinese takeaways. What about them? Did you know they found cat skins in 78% of all Chinese takeaways? Cat skins! Off cats! Then there's Kurds run the chip shop. What are Kurds doing running a chip shop round here when they should be fighting ISIS. Bloody Muslims. And let's not let the effing Jocks off either, let's kick them out too. That'll teach them for thinking about leaving. And Finkelstein the jeweller, FFS. Those people killed Christ! And that's not the worst of it either. A Sikh just went past on a moped. With a bleeding turban on. Englishmen have to wear helmets, but your bleeding Sikhs, helmet's not good enough for Johnny Sikh, so it isn't. Sikhs get whatever they want. Sharia law, that's what it is. There's going to be a bleeding dis-turban-ce round here, once I get my way.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    cont- spy on

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 05:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @43 Sad, isn't it? The ignorance of some posters.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 06:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Heisenbergcontext

    @40 ChrisR

    I'm more interested in asking you why it matters to you what people believe if their beliefs are a positive influence in their life and is not inflicted on anyone else?

    “Voltaire was born in 1694”. Indeed. And people are still inspired by his wisdom and facility.

    “I do not agree with what you say, but I will defend to the death your right to say it”.

    Four hundred years and no-one has been able to say it better. Everyone who has had the benefit of free speech owes a debt of gratitude to Voltaire IMO.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 06:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • DerkeBlake

    @43 HansNiesund

    Straw man; reducto ad absurdum; mal absurdum; denying the antecedent; etc etc etc
    Take your pick.
    That paragraph is far beneath your (usually cognizant) abilities. It's almost approaching Tobi'ish, in fact.
    If you have to travel to the ridiculous, you've lost before you started.
    Stay in the realm.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    spy on less than 5 year olds in kindergarten if they see any signs of jihadi tendencies…

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11323558/Anti-terror-plan-to-spy-on-toddlers-is-heavy-handed.html

    Besides it’s just futile even if they pass the bill or not, the state ideology never will be able to replace the family’s ideology and religious indoctrination. Loyalty and allegiance resides always in the parents and the community that nurtures the individual. The principle is that the government is going to spy on everyone’s kids Muslim and none Muslim as a result

    You are becoming the Orwellian State, spying on everyone as young as 3, telling people what they can publish, what they can say, what is Politically correct what is not. It’s all made for containment of an uneasy and unhealthy peace. The system can only work when there is enough migrants to move the economy and pay taxes for the elderly and the welfare state, the must States take away liberty and freedom from everyone –including both Muslims and none Muslims- and the ability of people to defend themselves.

    Not even then Europe will be able to curb its demographic winter, your capital rich class baby boomers are in retirement, this is as good as it’s going to get. From now on it’s Islamism, tensions, poverty, debt and terminal decline.

    UK may be lucky once the Eurozone collapses as there is going to be a massive capital flight to London, but you still cant escape the European principles.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 07:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 46 Heisenbergcontext
    “I'm more interested in asking you why it matters to you what people believe if their beliefs are a positive influence in their life and is not inflicted on anyone else?”

    IF only that were the case!

    I spent my informative years in the maw of the CofE due to my parents wish to ‘save’ me. They were great parents but could not understand why I wanted to throw the chance of ‘living forever’ away by renouncing religion when I was about 12 YO. Bear in mind I was the senior choirboy, confirmed by the Bishop of Lichfield and Head Altar server at a CoE ‘High Church’ and you didn’t get many of those. The problem was of course I found science which explained many things for me without the mumbo-jumbo of a medieval cant.

    No matter how positive a religion is on anyone it still affects others and I got sick and fed up of the bleats about you’ll change your mind on your deathbed, etc. etc. as if they knew me better than me.

    Well I have news for these self-centred cretins I have been VERY near death on two occasions and never felt the need to grasp at straws or “hedge my bets” and I am still here. No doubt there will be well intentioned people reading this that think a “god” saved me.

    “Everyone who has had the benefit of free speech owes a debt of gratitude to Voltaire IMO.” More like the free speech came from the political society in which they live IMO.

    There are millions of your Muslims who are neither free in speech or in will: all through the despotic “religion” they HAVE to follow having been bought into the world with the curse of being in a Muslim family.

    I will use this comparison between your ‘nice Muslims’ and the real world: I personally now at least 21 Argentines all of whom live outside their birth country by choice. They are ALL great people and I count them as friends. There are however at least 15M Peronistas in Argentina and from their ACTIONS need to be exterminated if ever the vile cycle affecting the other 25M Argentines is

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 07:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    you may well need these to help out.

    Top 10 Elite Fighting Units

    Interestingly the USA has 4 entries
    And the UK has 3,
    Russia-1
    France – 1
    Israel -1
    http://www.shockpedia.com/top-10-elite-fighting-units/10/

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 07:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    #43 You sound just like #48! Only he is still more absurd! He has never been here yet he knows all about Britain and he can even fortell us our future - lol! Perhaps he should be appointed to the Treasury or becomeca government advisor? He is cracking up already, foaming at the mouth and I havent even mentioned any of Argylands current problems yet!

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 07:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    51.

    You dont know anything about me nor my qualifications, where I have or have not being. That is the reason why some time ago you said I lived in some obscure London hood. You are just guessing stuff as you go along

    You have already being beaten time and time again today and HamasNiesund is anti Israel activist. He also has a large chip on his shoulder. I dont even bother with him any longer.

    Sure Argentina has its problems, I am not a denier, you are one, but you know nothing of Argentina, and I know to much about you... So what the hell its a unfair advantage.

    Spying on 3 yo toddlers. Not even the ones you claim to have thrown nuns of planes did that.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Voice

    I think you will find that @43 was taking the piss........
    ...Jeez....

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 08:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • The Voice

    They have been attacking Mosques and even Kebab Shops in France, just what the attackers were looking for. Marine le Pen and the Argie trolls must be rubbing their hands with glee. The Argys all want to be seen as Europeans but they fall way short on that front because of the dishonest environment many live in. Out in rural areas of their country many seem just like us unlike the morons you see posting bile on here.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 08:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • EscoSes Doido

    @49
    For me, faith is simply people pretending to know things that they don't.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 09:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    Fears in Europe of violent retaliation and Islamophobia following Paris killings

    Here's one muslim who got it right............................

    “Let's say ten thousand rattlesnakes coming to bite me and in that ten thousand, there was one thousand who didn't mean no harm, and I knew there was a good thousand snakes out there. They all look alike so what should I do? Keep the door open and let the ten thousand in, hoping that the thousand will unite and save me even though one bite will kill me. Should I be safe and shut the door?”

    Muhammad Ali

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 09:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    That doesn't really work in the context of muslim extremists.

    1.6 billion muslims in the world. Extremists don't even total 50,000.

    All terrorists are muslim except the 94% that are not.

    Let's get some perspective here.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @47

    Hey c'mon, reductio ad absurdum is my favourite reductio, and I hardly ever get the chance to trot out it here, because so much of the absurdity is irreducible already.

    @54

    What a bleeding disgrace! The bleeding Frogs are out burning down kebab shops and what are we doing! Surrendering, that's what! Eating the bleeding kebabs when the pubs close! It's time we went back to the pie! The pork one!

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    50k. Hardly a relevant number....how much damage could 50k possibly do? As a former soldier.......50k, I can do a lot of death. How many was needed for the infidels body count in 9/11? You sound like a politician. Playing the odds is great, until you are actually in that playground. They need to stop fighting the extremist with pc politicians overseeing.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Damn there is less than 50.000 extremists all over the Muslim word… Why don’t you say so to the CIA and the major intelligence services all over the world ( Mossad, FSB, MI6)

    How many trillions has the US being spending trillions of dollars on arming itself and upkeeping the war on terror sinse 2001??…Damn if only they had known its only 50 k extremists…. I cant even tell why they are still fighting in Afghanistan more than a decade if they have killed them all… 13 out of 14 global wars from Maghreb to Somalia, then north to Lybia, from Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsua, and Al Qaeda in the Indian subcontinent to ISIL, the Caucasus, Xingjian… wow all done by 50.000 thousand people. Alexander and Napoleon should be jealous !! Maybe they are the true warriors of Islam and the swords of Allah!!!

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    If all the 50,000 were in oner place there wouldn't be a problem.

    On the other hand, I know for a fact that Mr Lakhani down at the paper shop had nothing to do with it, since he was in the hospital having his piles done at the time.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 10:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Terrorism costs the world lots and generally people dont appreciate just how much because most people dont stop to think about it. Terrorists only success is to make everyone afraid out of all proportion to the damage caused and to cause disruption and discord where there is actually very little. France has the same problem that every nation with muslim minorities have, disaffected and damaged young people venting spite on communities that seem to reject them. B Liar and W threw fat on the smouldering fire and we are all reaping the consequences. The vast majority in Europe wont support further alienation of the Muslim communities. People here are far too sensible for that. Every major European country has suffered similar events without continuing internal conflict.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    In the least least but very least there is 200 Million “extremist” Muslims all over the world according to the Pew Research Center 2011 world wide poll of what Muslims think .... That is IF you dont consider sharia law extremist. If you consider Sharia law and the % of world Muslim that actually stand for that is close to about 72% more a less if you poll the populations of Indonesia, Morrocco, Turkey, Egypt, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Nigeria, Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestinian territories, Jordan, France, UK, US.. a total of 680 million extremists

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @63

    Boy, have you got a bad case of brown trousers, but I understand that's pretty common among extremists of all persuasions. But you can rest easy. If there are 680 million Muslim extremist, they must be nearly totally useless, or hardly any of us would be around today. Thank goodness for that.

    Did you notice yet that the first cop killed in Paris went by the name Ahmed Merabet? Apparently he wasn't a Catholic .....

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    What about 94% of terrorists that are not muslim? What are we to do about them? I say, kill everyone in the whole world, just to be safe.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @65

    Anybody who thinks you can rid the world of nutters by attacking the innocent is a nutter themselves.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    64. They are potential terrorists. Do you understand what “potential” means??....And thank God they are divided amongst shia and sunni and are far more concerned in killing each other instead of Christians- Its that you and Elaine keep on picking % and numbers inventing them out of your own arses.

    The polls and numbers are there. The ones that governments and intelligence sources use.

    http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2011/07/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Western-Relations-FINAL-FOR-PRINT-July-21-2011.pdf

    This is written by a liberal to answer Ben Shapiro that I posted earlier on and he picks the less but less troublesome questions that PRC asked in these same countries and he cant avoid 200 million extremists.
    http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2011/07/Pew-Global-Attitudes-Muslim-Western-Relations-FINAL-FOR-PRINT-July-21-2011.pdf

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    94% 72%...200 million.....50,000. All these stats.....do they actually come from some source?

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    How does one define a potential terrorist?

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @67

    That's an excellent article for once. Did you actually read it?

    “To be clear, we’re not saying there are 181 million radical Muslims. We’re simply saying by applying different but reasonable criteria to the same data, you can reach a vastly different result.”

    The article it links is even more telling and blows the roof of these kind of specious, bullshit numbers put about by people like Shapiro.

    “What I found was that what we receive as a true picture of what Muslims think is mostly an artefact of what they get asked and that the non-Muslims answer similar questions in a similar fashion. So 6% of my non-Muslim sample agreed that suicide bombings can be justified for reasons of Islamic terrorism: a copy of a similar question asked of Muslims, and which yielded comparable results.”

    http://blog.policy.manchester.ac.uk/featured/2014/08/can-we-ever-estimate-how-many-british-muslims-will-become-islamic-extremists/

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I only posted that article because it has the max and minimus of how you can intepret Pew Research Center, the author of that reply is a retard...

    Hitler killed 6 million Jews... But he loved animals and was very fond of his dogs.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    There were how many, 60,70, 80, 90, closer to 100 terrorist attacks by the IRA? Thank goodness we didn't kill all the Irish and, by association, all the catholics.

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @71

    You posted an article that completely destroyed your own argument.

    What has Hitler got to do with that?

    Jan 08th, 2015 - 11:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    70.
    Tell her to put a spin on 40% UK Muslims support Sharia law, and almost none have a favorable view of Israel and the Jews..

    What you cant deny is that 70% of world Muslims stand by Sharia law...

    Would you invite someone home who has those views, I for sure wouldnt. If I would commit my lives hands in people the 70% at least whom hold those values, I think its just retarded.

    Besides Shapiro is missing countries like Yemen, Oman, Lybia, Algeria, the ex USSR “Stan”countries and Malaysia.

    Im not saying bomb them in the Middle East, in fact Im all for leaving them alone and anti intervention... But letting them in?? No you have to be really stupid for that.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 12:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @74

    Read the article again. It explains exactly what's wrong with what you've just repeated.

    Or maybe try an Introduction to Statistics, because you obviously haven't grasped the fact that your analysis depends on your initial assumptions, and by manipulating these you can use the numbers to prove practically anything you like.

    Some people make a living out of that.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 12:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    The guy is an idiot Hamas, so are you, if I trully believed it had any value whatsoever I wouldnt have posted it... Its retarded, just because he holds one least extremist view it doesnt mean to say that he doesnt hold another..

    I already explained to you the category “say suicide bombing can sometimes be justified. ” The Muslim are divided among Sunni and Shia, the polls where done at the hight of the Arab Spring, most of the time terrorism is aimed at each other, its not suprising.

    Besides its still radicalism If Egypt has a population of 80 million people when the Muslim Brotherhood where winning the elections and gaining power 2011-2012 when they say sometimes it is actually justified it means 23 million people in Egypt hold extremist views. There is no spin on that.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 12:22 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Don Alberto

    I suggest you watch this one, an eye opener.

    Muslim asks about discrimination, gets awesome answer
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Owq8TkQ0AXA

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 01:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    Don I salute you for finding that video. I never watch them when posted here but something drove me to watch. Like the squeaky wheel gets the oil, so do the small percent of of Muslims.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 02:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Cruise ConTroll

    I live in the paradise of Mendoza, I don't have to worry about this at all, unlike in the hellholes of Sydney, Ottawa, Paris, London, Madrid, Washington, New York, Oslo, Moscow, Amsterdam, etc, etc...

    Thank Me I live in paradise.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 02:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Heisenbergcontext

    @49 ChrisR

    I didn't find the explanations for why I should believe in God any more convincing than the ones that were presented to you, so I never came to believe either. I still don't. However the experiences I had in my 30's, having met people whose spiritual beliefs ( religious or otherwise ) had obviously had a profoundly beneficial effect on their lives, allowed me to understand how people COULD come to believe and how that belief was both valuable and even necessary.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 03:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ilsen

    Je suis Charlie.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 03:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Ernie4001

    The islamic defenders say that are only some few guys are terrorist and that islam is a peaceful religion and bla bla bla ...and it´s true...but only after they killed you. The twin towers guys, Atocha and many other terrorist weren´t catholics, lutherans or from another religion, they were ISLAMICS.
    I dont know what else is expecting Europe to lock the doors for guys coming from those countries mayne more deaths. I hope not.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 03:53 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ilsen

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sEcBzxoMB8

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 03:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @76

    A figure of 860 million Muslim extremists isn't analysis, it's hysteria.

    In 2007, MI5 estimated that there were 2000 in the UK who “posed a direct threat to national security and public safety, because of their support for terrorism”. Note that “support for terrorism” it's not 2000 terrorists.

    (https://www.mi5.gov.uk/home/about-us/who-we-are/staff-and-management/director-general/speeches-by-the-director-general/intelligence-counter-terrorism-and-trust.html)

    That is of course 2000 too many. But to put this into perspective, it is certainly smaller than the number of white Christian moral imbeciles who were active on both sides of the Northern Ireland conflict during the 70s and 80s. It's also instructive to take note who they are :

    “Far from being religious zealots, a large number of those involved in terrorism do not practise their faith regularly. Many lack religious literacy and could actually be regarded as religious novices. Very few have been brought up in strongly religious households, and there is a higher than average proportion of converts. Some are involved in drug-taking, drinking alcohol and visiting prostitutes. The report claims a well-established religious identity actually protects against violent radicalisation, while the influence of clerics in radicalising British terrorists has reduced in recent years”

    https://www.mi5.gov.uk/home/about-us/who-we-are/staff-and-management/director-general/speeches-by-the-director-general/intelligence-counter-terrorism-and-trust.html)

    There's another thing that MI5 knows very well from the NI experience which is that nothing grows support for terrorism better than drastic action against the innocent. Bloody Sunday and internment without trial were the best recruiters the IRA ever had.

    And anybody with a brain in their head should be able to figure out that it's a rather poor strategy to fight something by giving it exactly what it wants.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 08:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Frankdrebin

    I once new a guy, a Muslim - university educated, British born and very intelligent. I worked with him for a number of years and thought I knew him well. This one afternoon we were all sitting in the office chatting, the conversation got around to terrorism and the 9/11 attacks - I think this was just after the 2005 London bombings. He piped up and started off a 5 minute rant denouncing America, trying to justify the 2001 attacks and the 2005 London bombings. the chilling thing was that he admitted that they were getting taught to hate America and the western way of life in the mosques.

    You cant tar them all with the same brush but it as a previous poster has pointed out, Muslims have not come out on mass to denounce these attacks which were supposedly done in their name. This will only get worse.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @84

    “I mentioned earlier that the number of people we are seeing involved in terrorist-related activity in the UK has increased TO AT LEAST 2,000. And we suspect that there are as many again that we don't yet know of.”

    In case you haven’t noticed Hamas that article is 10 years old, and he said the amount of people that are involved in terrorism in the UK that is different than the amount of UK Muslims that hold extremist views that is much but much more higher.

    Douglas Murray said there is at least 3 or 4 attacks per week that are foiled. You just don’t get to see them in the news. The French are working the same way, they have the Mosques infiltrated they had the people that went to Syria profiled but you can’t put in jail people that have yet to commit terrorism in the home country.

    Hamas its very simple
    If you were to say to me that only 10% of UK Muslims actually support Al Qaeda and terrorism it’s one thing. 3 million Muslims in the UK that makes it 300K potential terrorist in the whole country that is one thing, but if 78% wants the cartoonist legally prosecuted it means to say that they don’t adapt to western values like freedom of speech, 2,3 million of them. It’s a clash of civilizations, it’s a cause of tension and it’s only set to increase as the Muslim population rises and they don’t get assimilated.

    The first step to solve a problem is to admit you have one.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 01:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @86

    And so 2,000 are suddenly 300,000, now? What are they, rabbits? Have you told MI5 yet?

    And whoever said there wasn't a problem? Of course there's a problem. It's perfectly bleeding obvious there's a problem.

    But what there isn't a problem of, is of a unified force 860 million strong coming over the hill in baggy pants waving their scimitars, that can be repelled by turning on those who have nothing to do with it but just happen to be standing closer with approximately the same trousers on.

    But by all means keep helping out those crazies who dream of such things by dignifying your own bigotry with this clash of civilisation nonsense. It's exactly what they want to hear, and exactly what they're trying to provoke. Birds of a feather, the same mindset.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    It's amazing how difficult it is to simply talk numbers and statistics to liberals who have their heads so stuck up their arses looking for fairy tales in their ascending colons.

    Hamas. There is 2000 British fighters in ISIL alone!!!!

    Read again the @86. Its all explained there. You mix up categories, you don’t think you don’t read, you just troll me. You are too stupid.
    Involved in actual terrorism doesn’t equal potential terrorism and that doesn’t equal the amount of people embracing sharia law and that are incompatible with western culture

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 02:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @88
    Jesus Christ, is your methodology still as crude and fuck-witted as that, even after you already posted yourself an article exposing it? None of the numbers you have posted are credible in themselves, and your interpretation of them is even less so. It's a textbook case of confirm basis. I'm sure this terrible fear you have fulfils some kind of need, but it bears little resemblance to the real threat.

    The figure of 2000 Brits in ISIL is another good example. The figure has been claimed by one British MP, and it is substantiated by precisely nothing. MI5, who should know better, say 500 but they admit they have no reliable information either. Meanwhile, Brit jihadis are found to have downloaded “Islam for Dummies” before setting off, large numbers of foreign ISIL fighters, it appears, are trying to get out now that they've realised what they've got into, and ISIL is cutting their heads off. And you seem to think the answer to this is to close down kebab shops or something.

    Pretty soon you'll be turning up with a link to the Protocols of the Elders of Islam, or some such.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 03:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I don’t have time for you today, I have pretty much explained everything, there is no cure for people like you. Not only you are being stupid when it comes to numbers and just common sense. You are VERY ignorant on statistics.

    Hamas in collage they taught us ways to see how you can detect lies in statistics. You can visually present the data in multiple ways making the bars larger and the % of variables smaller in the ordinate axis to show bigger increases than they really exist. Likewise when you want to decrease the evidence shown you “zoom out” so to speak. There is ways in which the way you ask questions just by semantics when you poll a population can you get an advance in result that suits your benefit. There is many other ways, but other than manipulating the actual data you can’t actually lie about the statistics.

    When Greenberg says “To be clear, we’re not saying there are 181 million radical Muslims. We’re simply saying by applying different but reasonable criteria to the same data, you can reach a vastly different result.”

    He is actually saying there are at least 181 million radicals using the less troublesome indicators. If statistics was so free lance and you can interpret any way you want the data then there is no point in making these polls. Why did Pew Research Center even bother in making 2 years polls in all these countries (which is very expensive) if you can interpret the results as you please in any way it fits your political agenda??

    I repeat I only posted his article because it has a nice table where you can see a good estimates between the maximum (Shapiro) and minimum (Greenberg) of extremists.

    Ben Shapiro says all Sharia supporters are extremists, I think Sharia is extremist but that doesn’t mean to say a sharia follower will indulge in the actual terror activity. In fact I wrote earlier on @63. But it does mean that of 100 Muslims you pick worldwide 72 of them want to live under sharia. And that IS A STATISTICAL CONCLUSION.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 04:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 65 ElaineB
    “What about 94% of terrorists that are not muslim?”

    You are contradicting your own post @ 57, would you please clarify what you mean and if possible include the source?

    @ 72 ElaineB

    Although you appear just slightly younger than me (~60) your grasp of the damage that just the IRA carried out is woeful and I suspect you never had any friends badly injured by these terrorists who on their own carried out 1,300 armed attack on the population of the UK. 652 UK armed forces and 272 RUC were killed directly as a result of these cretins. And what about the ‘Provos’?

    Do you recall the Birmingham pub bombings? It was only good fortune I was not there that night but two of my friends were and suffered terrible injuries. Do you remember the Brighton Hotel bombing and the absolute disaster that caused, not only for the deaths but particularly for Margaret Tebbit: that poor women was left in a dreadful state and had to live in a wheelchair for the rest of her life unable to really communicate with anyone?

    At that time the security services claimed there were just 278 members and I know for a fact that the SAS had plans top kill them all but the craven politicians messed themselves at the thought. It was an opportunity missed.

    I wonder if you would have the ambivalent attitude that you seem to have if (perish the thought) one of your grandchildren was killed by Muslim extremists, or would that be different?

    There ARE people in this world who DO deserve to die, without trial or any of the civil niceties that they have abandoned for the rest of us, we should start with all the known and suspected Islamists terrorists, wherever they are, especially those returning to the UK having ‘fought’ with ISIL.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 04:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    You really have entirely lost the plot this time.

    When Greenberg says “... we’re not saying there are 181 million radical Muslims. We’re simply saying by applying different but reasonable criteria to the same data, you can reach a vastly different result.“, he is not in fact actually saying there are at least 181 million radicals using the less troublesome indicators. What he is saying is ”TO BE CLEAR, WE'RE NOT SAYING THERE ARE 181 MILLION RADICAL MUSLIMS. WE'RE SIMPLY SAYING BY APPLYING DIFFERENT BUT REASONABLE CRITERIA TO THE SAME DATA, YOU CAN REACH A VASTLY DIFFERENT RESULT“.

    Or in other words, he is not saying the data is right or wrong, he is saying you can make the same data say whatever you like, depending on you define it. Shapiro has taken a completely ignorant interpretation of sharia law, and used that to generate the hysterical figure of 820 million slavering maniacs, etc, etc, and Greenberg shows exactly how this done, without attempting to provide a better figure.

    The Sobolewska article referenced by Greenberg provides the remarkable conclusion that you get the same answers to the same questions whether you ask them to Muslims or non-Muslims, and concludes ”one can hardly claim that these questions represent a true picture of the likelihood of British Muslim becoming extremists and terrorists.

    It is truly scary to think that our counter-terrorism policy may rely on these polls and similar questions in other surveys (like the Citizenship Survey) in their estimations of likely terrorists. Given the absolute lack of reliability of public opinion on support for extremism and terrorism, one has to ask how MI5, the government, the so-called experts and the various MPs who have spoken on the issue are developing their estimates?”

    Or in short, there are no reliable figures anywhere on the real number of Muslim terrorists, and Shapiro et al are just pulling numbers out of their arse for scare-mongering purposes, and the gullible fall for it.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 05:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @91 I think you misunderstand me mentioning the IRA bombing campaign. It was to stress that non-muslims also carry out terrorist attacks and it was far more sustained than the current Islamic extremist campaign. We didn't react by suggesting that all Irish should be expelled from the country or by association all catholics.

    If you make something personal, you have already lost the debate. You have absolutely no idea what tragedies have befallen my loved ones, what situations they and I have been subjected to, and I am certainly not going to share it with you or use such tragedies to score points on a message board.
    Suffice to say I have seen things you will never have to. And you can thank whatever deity or demigod you choose.

    At no point have I ever defended Islamic extremism. Not once. However to blame 1.6 billion people for the actions of a small minority is beyond stupid. Why not obliterate all Christians because Anders Breivik killed all those young people? It is the blind prejudice that I cannot stomach.

    Maybe you can ask some of your 'SAS contacts” just how many muslims are risking their lives feeding the security services information to try to stop the nutters claiming to act in the name of Islam.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 05:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 93 ElaineB
    “and I am certainly not going to share it with you or use such tragedies to score points on a message board.
    Suffice to say I have seen things you will never have to. And you can thank whatever deity or demigod you choose.”

    I think you just did.

    I would have thought by now you would know I am an atheist AND a pragmatist, which is why killing the perpetrators of these Islamist acts does achieve one thing: they won’t do it again. And please don’t come back with the old chestnut that such acts only provoke others: these morons would do it anyway.

    Confusing 1.6Bn Muslims with 55,000 terrorists is less than helpful. We can kill 55,000 and deal with those who ‘some people’ would claim we have radicalised after.

    Frankly, given the nonsense that is Islam with all the ‘kill the Kafirs’, ‘honour killings’ of their own girls, etc., it will only end when the majority of the 1.6Bn are no longer in the world and the sooner the better.

    I would rather exterminate these stupid, stupid people than have just one of my extended family killed by them.

    Religion has always and will always be, the scourge of society: it’s run by delusionists for their own ends, even if it's only 'they know best'.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 06:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @94 Well, why don't YOU start killing them all. Don't just sit there. And while you are at it you can remove the hand of anyone you think is a thief. Will you crucify them or stone them or behead them? Well, gosh, you are no better than the Islamic extremists. An atheist* extremist, perhaps? Good luck with trying to find the 50,000 so you can eliminate them. And when you have finished you can move onto other religions and kill their extremists. You wouldn't want to be seen as a bigot would you?

    *Quite frankly I don't pay that much attention to your posts unless you address me directly so I didn't know or care.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 06:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    Well, that's 18 innocent people dead in 3 days. I don't think that any sane person is going to view Islam as the “Religion of peace” any more.

    It does appear that we can not count on the 94% of “peaceful” Islamists to protect us from the 6% of “bad” Islamists

    The last 3 days have shown the whole world what a violent, barbaric cesspit of hate and bile Islam truly is.

    If you still think that Islam is a peaceful religion, go and look at Iran and the intolerance they have there towards women's rights and homosexuality or what about Saudi Arabia? Behold the wonders of Islam!!! In all it's glory..........

    Reason enough we should turn our backs on this outdated nonsense in all of it's putrid, women hating, homophobic, anti-Semitic idiocy.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 07:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @96
    Of course Islam isn't a religion of peace. There's no such thing as a religion of peace. That's not what they're for.

    @94
    I can see from the machismo point of view, this is the way to go, real big swinging dick stuff, and no mistake.

    Some wishy-washy bleeding hearts might think of course there's a kind of minor difficulty in identifying the 55,000 guilty among the 1.6 billion. but that doesn't matter a damn if we keep it simple and just make out they're all guilty. Kind of like kafirs in reverse, what.

    There have been 4 perpetrators in France. So that just leaves 4,703,996 to go. Let's hope they all sit still till we get round to them.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 07:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Hamas

    I find it really pathetic and funny that you are using copy pasting and depending on as your exclusive source the article I only used as to show the tables and the rest I dismissed as utter crap.

    You are a total wanker and you keep on sinking your head futher and futher up inside yourself. Answer this questions yes or no…

    1) Is Sharia extremist in your view ?
    2) Do you mind living under sharia law or at least people that wish to do so in their own way?
    3) Do you find it compatible that 70% of UK Muslims wanting the Danish cartoonist killed / prosecuted is compatible with Western values & Civilization ?
    4) Is someone that thinks that sometimes is terrorism justified a terrorist?

    YES OR NO!

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 07:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    They say, their are a few wise men, and millions of fools,

    millions of fools dispute this argument,
    history proves the wise men agree with this argument..

    so they say...

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 07:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    1 Yes and no. Which sharia laws do you mean? Here is a helpful article that will explain to you what sharia actually is: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia.

    Here also is an extract from another helpful article about the attitudes of British Muslims : “Asked if they would prefer to live under Sharia law or British law, 30% said Sharia while 54% preferred British law .... sharia law does not necessarily equate to the hand-chopping, adulterer-stoning version in the tabloid press, Western countries like Canada have in the past allowed the use of Sharia law under limited circumstances for things like inheritance law, so it was then impossible to tell exactly what people were supporting.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia.

    I'm not bothered at Canada. I am kind of against hand-chopping and that kind of stuff, if I reflect open it for about the time it takes two neurons to fire. I think that's ridiculously extremist.

    2. Of course I do. Just as well there's absolutely no chance of it, huh?

    3. Killed and prosecuted aren't the same thing. It's not news that freedom of speech is a point of difference between Muslims and non-Muslims. Of course I don't think this is compatible with Western values. And it doesn't follow from this that all Muslims support extremist reactions. Here, for example is what one of those namby-pamby Middle eastern so-called moderate Muslims thinks :

    “The leader of the Shi'ite Muslim group Hezbollah said on Friday that Islamist terrorists had done more harm to Islam than any cartoon or book, a reference to the attack by suspected Islamist militants on French satirical newspaper Charlie Hebdo.”

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sharia.

    Nasrallah is currently fighting ISIS, apparently.

    4. No. Some may be supporters of terrorists, or enablers of it, but if its all their head, they aren't terrorists, just imbeciles.

    Try to learn to make distinctions.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 08:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Mendoza Canadian

    Lets set the record straight. The Koran does NOT prohibit images of the prophet. http://www.answering-islam.org/Muhammad/pictures.html
    I think its time that every newspaper, magazine and TV station printed and broadcast a picture of the prophet. I for one am going to post one on my fb page. They are available on the internet. http://www.answering-islam.org/Muhammad/pictures.html

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 08:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @101

    Cool.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 08:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    As a reminder regarding the 94% peace loving Muslims. This is a religion that have father's killing their daughters when they've been raped. Stoned to death women who had sex out of marriage. The list of the 94% goes on. So....perhaps that 94% are not killing infidel just yet....but it is by far a violent and barbaric group.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 08:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Well that makes things much easier-

    1) You don’t consider Sharia extremist
    2) You say would mind living under it… the question was not if it was going to happen or not it’s already happening in your country
    3) Killed or prosecuted, because if 70% of UK muslims think they ought to be prosecuted a fair deal of them must have yesterday at least being saying “they had it coming”. Not surprising now Nasrahllah is your hero being an anti semitic turd you are.
    4) So you don’t consider a potential terrorist someone who says that suicide bombings and terrorist attacks are justified.

    That is just great. There is nothing left to talk about.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @104 CaudilloDenso2

    Try reading what I actually said. I know that sort of thing is hard for you, but once you get the hang of it, you will look less of a woodentop.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 09:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 95 ElaineB

    Well, that was a nice little rant from someone who by her own admission doesn’t understand that moderate Muslims who are fed up with the mainstream kill, stone, burn, knife, whatever complexion of Muslim in your neighbourhood, CANNOT leave this damnable sect or THEY will be killed!

    Who also doesn’t accept that if you are born into a Muslim family the same applies (you can’t leave) or you will be killed.

    If I still lived in the UK and was about 30 or so now I am confident that the day would come when defending my family from these crazy, crazy, people might well be necessary. The difference between us of course is I wouldn’t even blink an eye while I did it (it puts the aim off).

    BTW, in the UK you can have any number of Section 1 firearms as long as you have a reason / need. In TDC as a private individual they seek to restrict you to 10 guns which is why many are ‘off ticket’. THESE of course are the dangerous ones; no-one knows where they are.

    Of course, if you think about it rationally you will realise that you can only fire 2 pistols or one rifle / shotgun at the same time.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 09:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Its YES or NO.

    You dont find Sharia extremist, basically a premedieval law that was invented to keep the peoples of the Middle East so wildly shit scared of the clerics and their rulers. Which has had not one reformation nor one retractation like Christianity has over more than a millenium. I dont think there is any exeptions. You abide by the law of the land. What was the point of the French Revolution ?? If they want Sharia there is over 50 states that have it.

    FFS. Yemen and Saudi Arabia until 1962; Mauritania until 1980 was slavery legal under proto sharia constitutions

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 09:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Anbar

    Whilst I find it an impossibility to agree with anything that CB spouts... anybody who thinks that its only a tiny minority of Muslims that support the “attack is best” approach to spreading their religion and its control of everything in your life... you're kidding yourself.

    It an insidious and highly dangerous meme.

    .....but what religion isnt eh?

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 09:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Rick from Maryland

    So... Here is my answer....

    :-(

    A cartoon of the smiling prophet

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @107

    It's not YES or NO. It's YES and NO. Some implementations of some parts of it in some countries legals systems are sick. Some of it is no big deal at all. I know these subtleties are tough for you, but here's another link that might help you to understand what you're talking about. No need to worry about your blood pressure, it isn't a hate site.

    http://bridgingcultures.neh.gov/muslimjourneys/items/show/226

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    110.
    If you want it fine go to Saudi Arabia or make Britain a caliphate as most of you seem to be OK with anyway. Because there is no need for a coma of it when you already have western democratic law.

    I dont want it and consider it extremist.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @111

    You're really not paying attention at all tonight. Are your glasses all steamed up or something, or is the windscreen wiper broken on your monitor? What I said was, I didn't want it. And I also think there's no need for a comma of it when we already have western democratic law. Is that clear enough for you now?

    Just in case you're still a little confused, I don't have any problem either with the idea of a war on radical islamists, and their prophet can go fuck himself as far as I'm concerned. I just have a problem with the truly witless idea of attacking the innocent by some process of association that doesn't stand up to five minutes of serious examination. That and some quaint wimpy notion of respecting the democratic Western values we're supposed to be defending, and rejecting the atavistic stupidity of giving the jihadis exactly what they're trying to get.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @111 I think having to have a load of guns to be extreme. What do you need to defend yourself from in Argentina?

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    112
    People are obviously starting to gett pissed off with me here. And they are right.

    I have already shown you the evidence, sources, numbers, statistics, the facts everything. Your attitude and approach is more than a decade long. And not only it has miserably failed, the problems seem to be getting worse and worse.

    I just cant discuss anymore with someone that doesn't consider Sharia extreme.

    The Argentine military solved this with a some quick rides in the old Green Falcon and a C-17 feeding the fishes of the River Plate.
    Me?? Don’t know where they are. I never seeing anything, maybe they where up to something I don’t know…

    113
    You must be Piers Morgan with a vagina.... Or well Piers Morgan doesn't have a dick so anyway...

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @114

    Yes, I do recall you were in favour of Videla's attempt to electrocute his way to prosperity. How's that worked out for ya, by the way?

    @113
    And there we go, as night follows day, misogyny follows Islamophobia.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 10:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    115.
    It worked just fine.
    They stopped communism for 20 years in Argentina and Chile is almost a developed country following Pinochet's legacy.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 11:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @116

    I guess that explains then why Argentina is such a reference model for economic management. But who are these Ks I keep hearing about? And wasn't there some sort of national humiliation in 1982? I can't help thinking you might have been better off if you'd tried these western democratic values you're so eager to defend.

    How many Ford Falcons and C17s do you need, by the way, to dispose of 850 million Muslims? Or was it 820 million? They're popping them out so quick these days I can hardly remember.

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    *C-130

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 11:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @118

    What's the Muslim carrying capacity of a C-130? Supposing they were gassed first? I understand you might still have historical experience to draw upon round about Bariloche, but I guess they must be pretty old by now. Probably a bit leery too of getting lifted by Mossad, I shouldn't wonder.

    Gosh, but this defending Western values gets difficult when you start getting your teeth into it, though, doesn't it?

    Jan 09th, 2015 - 11:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    https://www.google.com/search?q=islamic+honor+killings&rlz=1Y3JHSK_enUS613US620&oq=islamic+honor+killing&aqs=chrome.1.69i57j0l3.16438j0j4&client=ms-android-att-us&sourceid=chrome-mobile&espv=1&ie=UTF-8#imgrc=ljlqiQUVgzJ7lM%253A%3Bundefined%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fi296.photobucket.com%252Falbums%252Fmm182%252Ftwyacht%252F4c1a_0146-1.jpg%3Bhttp%253A%252F%252Fwww.downrange.tv%252Fforum%252Findex.php%253Ftopic%253D18536.0%3B440%3B35

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 12:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @119 HansNiesund,
    Why do you make fun of CabezaDura2?
    He has some extremely good points.
    Please tell me of a nation where muslims live in peace with their non-muslim neighbours. l can't think of one.
    No matter how “good” some muslim individuals are, that you know, they still belong to a backward, violent religion which is in confrontation with EVERY other religion on earth.
    When the chips are down, when its time to step up to the plate, THEY ARE STILL MUSLIMS.
    Forget that at your peril.
    @95 ElaineB,
    Are your eyes open?
    Or are you asleep like most of Europe.
    PC people will be the death of the White races.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:36 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Naziism is still alive and well in South America. This thread is living proof. Thickheaded leading the way…

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 08:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    121 lsolde

    “Please tell me of a nation where muslims live in peace with their non-muslim neighbours.”

    The Koran teaches us that it is not possible. “People of the book” ( any other religion to you and me ) MUST be confronted and converted to Islam BY ANY MEANS.

    Penalty for converting from Islam to any other religion is death. Time for the rest of the world to wake up.............

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vl641IFO10g

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @114 I is a valid question. You claim there are very few Muslims in Argentina and they all want to be Catholic anyway, so what do you need all those guns for? Who are you scared of? Other Argentines? Catholics?

    @115 It was inevitable. CD2 sounds like a walking Daily Mail. I wonder if he knows he is being fed bullshit. He couldn't answer my question though.

    @121 My eyes are wide, wide open. It is hard to believe that CD2 wants to wipe Muslims off the face of the earth just because there is a minority extremist element. The Nazis had the same ideas about the Jews.

    I have not supported the Islamic extremists in any way. I would not support any extremism, under any banner.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @124 ElaineB,
    l never suggested that you do support lslamic extremists, Elaine.
    l think that for all your worldly experiences(& you seem a worldly person, l enjoy reading your posts), that you have a rather naive idea about what lslam is all about. lt is definitely NOT a religion of peace.
    Nobody should be in any doubt of their plans for the world.
    They have given us all plenty of warnings.
    Most politicians prefer to keep their heads in the sand, like osteriches.
    Don't judge them by your tolerant standards because they will not do the same to you.
    By the time that Europe awakes, it will be too late.
    CD2 was being insulting to you(out of frustration)& may have said that he wants to wipe muslims off the face of the earth, but that is exactly what the muslims want to do with us(the ones that they cannot convert that is).
    To defend their perverted religion is to defend the indefensible.
    Let them practice it in their own country & not ours.
    l don't know why the Nazis perscecuted the Jews.
    l did not think that there were extremist Jews in Germany in the 1930s.
    So really that doesn't make any sense in this context.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 10:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 125 lsolde

    First class post, I agree with EVERY word.

    ElaineB appears to travel the world by first class and is 'employed' by (if not governments) the World Bank or some other, similar organisation. I have done a few years of that and you have to watch yourself, it's very easy to believe you are the same as these people: she will meet the westernised face of Islam who will smile at her and talk as if they really are civilised BUT they still go to the mosque and, worst of all, they are STLL Muslims and read and believe the Quran.

    Regrettably there are many like people who really have no experience of the world at the shitty end and are frightened to even consider it.

    @ 116 CabezaDura2

    Keep the faith! You might call me names at times but so what? :o)

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 11:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @125 I never said it was a religion of peace. Not once. I don't think any religion is inherently peaceful.

    I totally understand the aims of Islamic extremists and I don't underestimate their intentions. They claim to work in the name of Islam but like all murderous terrorist groups, to serve their own ends. Islam is a convenient vehicle.

    CD2 attacks me personally because I showed him up when he was making misogynist and racist remarks a while ago. He can't get over it and falls back into his misogyny whenever he loses his temper. I find it amusing, so no worries.

    You should look at the similarities between the ideology of the Nazis and what some posters on here are suggesting. It is shocking.

    @126 Everything you say about me is supposition and based on the trolls fishing about my background. Enjoy your blinkered naivety, I am sure you find it comforting.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Mendoza Canadian

    Then there is the fact that the two factions of Islam, Sunni and Shia hate each other also.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 12:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @128 Mendoza Canadian,
    And they blow up each other's mosques also.
    They have no respect for their own religion, so they certainly have none for ours.
    @127 ElaineB,
    There is, of course, no need for CD2 to get personal with you or anyone else.
    Re-reading his posts l believe that he was getting frustrated that no-one else could see things, re lslam, that he could or thought he could.
    He has a few valid points & of course, we wouldn't have these problems if there had been NO muslim immigration in the first place.
    The politicians have been repeatedly warned, but pressed ahead with their air-headed, warm fuzzy feeling plans & the general public was left having to carry the can as usual.
    Our grandchildren & great-grandchildren will curse us for it.
    Look at the bigger picture & ignore anything personal from CD2 or anyone else for that matter.
    lts not too late to stop the rot, if we can find any politicians/governments with any guts & a thick skin.
    The first step is to stop this pc rubbish. l have experienced it myself & some of the idiots back down when you stand up to them.
    l have a thick skin(thick face, they call it in Asia)& l care jackshit what people think of me.
    @ 126 ChrisR,
    Thank you for your support.
    Doesn't it say somewhere that it is permissible for muslims to lie to non-muslims if it benefits or protects muslims in any way?
    Think l read that somewhere.
    Peace

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @ElaineB
    You are just bullshit…..You are not even worthy of any credibility in this subject after stating that a more than a decade conflict, that is forcing 13 out of 14 world conflicts in today’s world, that has made the USA spend trillions over the years, and is not even close to winning it yet, was all driven by less than 50.000 extremists.
    I said over and over I don’t want the Muslims all over the world wiped out. But live with them side by side, bring them over to Europe ?? Excuse me you are completely deluded. There is statistics, there is numbers which you will refuse to even see them and discuss them.
    Yes I’ve got guns they are all inherited by me
    Yes I said you are a Piers Morgan with a vagina
    So?? Are you going to cry a rainbow or you going to discharge just on those grounds? It has all has come out of backlash to your own idiocy as Isolde says
    You know what is the problem Elaine ?? Why I got so attacked, why people are SO OBVIOUSLY UNCOMFORTABLE with what I say. It’s not because you believe I’m a nazi a misogynist or anything you make up. You don’t like at all what I say and if anybody is afraid of the Muslims it’s the appeaser trying to feed the crocodile for him to eat him last.

    @Isolde

    thanks for your support!

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Unless governments stop it migration from poorer regions of the world to richer areas will continue. I dont think anyone since the Nazis has ever tried religious discrimination on the scale many on this site advocate. Nazi like folk like Thickheaded and tbe rest of you are a tiny minority. You can huff and puff in anonimity but you cannot point to anywhere where the sort of extreme tactics you advocate against Muslims or other religious groups is national policy. Sure there are many countries where foreigners find themselves disadvantaged and that includes Britain, Germany and France and to a degree it happens almost everywhere. Personally I meet many ordinary people of Muslim faith. I dont think I have ever met anyone like these terrorists. Its a problem of racism and ignorance from both sides and its never going to go away even if we do adopt Nazi tactics. So, just get used to continuing migration and eventual total integration..

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @130 “@ElaineB You are just bullshit”

    Oooh, well argued.

    “Yes I’ve got guns they are all inherited by me ”

    But why do you keep them? What are you so afraid of?

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @132
    Yes of course ... that all what you have to say and that is all what matters to you.

    Divert, call everyone a racist, a gun loon a misogynist, whatever.

    There is no cure for you… If you don’t want to take the red pill and choose to live in the Matrix. But at least just say so.

    Then you wonder why I call you an idiot.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 01:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @133 Still not prepared to admit you keep them because you are scared of other Argentines. Well, given all the armed home invasions you are probably right to have some form of protection.

    I am not calling everyone a misogynist, just you.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 02:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    But, you are so obviously an idiot! Why not mention it?

    I have seen this Argy gun thing time and again, its a sign of weakness. Think like thugs, act like thugs, live like thugs. You seem very keen to dosh out dodgy advice but dont like it when someone stands up to you. I remember people like that in the playground. It all fits perfectly. Hitlers hate campaign was a diversion that fooled a whole nation. The same thing is true today in Argentins. Instead of Juden signs and book burning you have Malvinas signs, a state sponsored hate campaign with a government minister leading it, piles of burning tyres, thugs intimidating British pensioners from cruise ships, and paid thugs throwing rocks at the BBC. And, a large body of your population swallowing it whole. And we have morons like Thickheaded trying their pathetic best to stir up hatred. Its all deflection just like the worst aspects of Naziism. We aint buying it because we aint as twisted and pathetically desperate as you lot.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 02:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @121

    I make fun of Cabecita because he's a nasty little fascist, not much different from the Islamofascists he opposes, he's an easy wind-up, and he's peddling a lot of hysterical bullshit which is not only specious but dangerous.

    The very first principle of any conflict is to know your enemy. Some would like us to believe that the whole Muslim is our enemy, which at leats had the advantage of being easy to grasp. The only problem is that it bears little relation to reality, and it's not just a distraction from the real enemy, it actually favours them. You can call it PC if you like, but I am not going to buy anything so fuck-witted from anybody.

    As for the real enemy, you fisrt have to consider these groups. They are not all the same. Most of them have their origin in regional politics rather than Islam, and they are a response to that rather than a crusade against the West. The Taliban are an attempt to restore order in a society broken by warlords and invasion. Al-Shabab are something similar. Boko Haram are a nutjob ciriminal-whacko-religious like many which exist in Africa, most of them Christian (e.g the Lord's Resistance Army). Hamas and Hizbollah are a response to the dispossession to the dispossession of the Palestinians. ISIS is a result of the collapse of Iraqi society (such as it was) post-invasion, the disbanding of the Iraqi army, and Malik's discrimination against the Sunnis. Certainly some members of these groups want a war of civilization against the West, but you can't say they constitute a unified force, or that war against the west is even the primary goal of any of them. That's Al-Qaeda. But Al-Qaeda isn't 850 million strong, they don;t even the other figure of 50,000 that's being bandied about.

    The idea that this whole mess can be tackled by acting against Mr Lakhani down at the paper shop, seeing as some madman in India professing the same religion cut their daughter's head off, is one of the most fuck-witted I ever saw even here.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 02:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    “It’s a problem of racism and ignorance from both sides and its never going to go away even if we do adopt Nazi tactics. So, just get used to continuing migration and eventual total integration..”

    So in other words, you will defend yourself by leaving your daughters to do the fighting like wasps.... defending themselves with their tails and you will hide behind your daughters. Because that is how it works, yes as vulgar and simple as that it’s how your alternative works.

    But fine if that is your solution...

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 02:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @136

    “I make fun of Cabecita because he's a nasty little fascist, not much different from the Islamofascists he opposes, he's an easy wind-up, and he's peddling a lot of hysterical bullshit which is not only specious but dangerous. ”

    I agree with all of that.

    Lovely friend you have there, Chris R.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 03:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 127 ElaineB

    I don’t lie, I learnt when I was very young that I have a poor memory for trivia and was always being caught out: the embarrassment was worse than the lie. SO, I believe people I weet until I am proven wrong. Yes, I get caught but that is down to them IMO.

    So I believed you when you claimed to have been to the US government in Washington (Senate was it?).

    I believed you when you claimed you travel by Dreamliner where possible because the beds are great.

    I believed you when you claimed to have visited an argie school and that you wouldn’t leave a dog in those conditions never mind children.

    I could go on and on, so now you are telling me that these are “supposition”? That’s a funny definition to use for that word.

    I suspect a lot of us will view your future posts in a different light. I am confident you know the saying “it’s takes little time to destroy your credibility but years to get it back.

    @ 129 lsolde
    “Doesn't it say somewhere that it is permissible for muslims to lie to non-muslims if it benefits or protects muslims in any way?”

    Yes, it does and it also allows the ‘believer’ to consume ALCOHOL in the pursuance of Allah’s work: killing non-believers must be No. 1 on the list.

    Isn’t that convenient for the alcohol drinkers who also happen to be Muslims?

    I think it was Redp0ll who mentioned that on his holiday he shared his beers with the workers on the boat he was on in Egypt but they were wary of their Imam catching them.

    @ 138 ElaineB
    “Lovely friend you have there, Chris R.”

    If you are referring to Isolde then I would be most honoured for her to call me ‘friend’.

    I won’t hold my breath in your case however.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 04:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @139

    ”ElaineB appears to travel the world by first class and is 'employed' by (if not governments) the World Bank or some other, similar organisation. “

    That is supposition.

    ”So I believed you when you claimed to have been to the US government in Washington “

    True but not the senate and that doesn't indicate my employment.

    ”I believed you when you claimed you travel by Dreamliner where possible because the beds are great.“

    True I choose the dreamliner between the US and Chile but they don't have first class only business class.

    See how easy it is for you to take a fact a make it into fiction?

    ”I believed you when you claimed to have visited an argie school and that you wouldn’t leave a dog in those conditions never mind children.“

    True.

    And….

    I was referring to your new best friend:

    ”@ 116 CabezaDura2

    Keep the faith! You might call me names at times but so what? :o)”

    I have no problem with Isolde. I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 05:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @ElaineB

    Men tend to be like that, we swear are heads off at each other but we tend to move on and the next day is another day. It doesnt mean to say we are friends nor enemies.

    Otherwise I see this as a really vile attempt to alienate me from anyone who dares agree with me. In case you haven’t noticed Isolde a Falklander agrees with me, much to me surprise.

    You have to ask yourself why is that you have that desperate need.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 05:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @141 I was answering ChrisR's post. Why does that bother you?

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 05:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    None at all exempt that First of all why does ChrisR's comments addressed to me, bother you??

    Why do you feel that desperate need to alienate me from anyone that dares agree with me??

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 05:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @143 Your own words alienate you, you don't need any help from me.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    144 Do they ?? So why do you do so??

    Have you seen your white knight none other than Conqueror who wishes to nuke the Middle East entirely coming to the rescue of a Government official who is paid to sleep around rich businessman in Latam and spend their taxes and you are the entire opposite ideology ...

    I only said that Muslims should be limited into their own countries. But nuke them.. ohh he is not a nazi compared to me. The problem is that Im correct, he is just a brute.

    Should I fuss that he is your friend now?? Nahh he is not, you are disgusted by him.

    Well I guess there are those victims who rather be useful tools I guess, you are the smart ones in control.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 06:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @145 You have the mind of an 11 year old in the playground. I don't have any white knights, I don't need a gang around me, I am perfectly capable of stating my opinion without help.

    You seem very insecure and needy. Desperate not to lose your new friend.

    You really are in the realms of fantasy about my life. Live it up. Think what you want. It is of no consequence to me.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 06:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    146.
    But if I’m an 11 year old in the playground.. Why do you feel so threatened about what I say? Why do you want to alienate me? Why do you mince my words? Why do you deflect all the time?? Why don’t you discuss the numbers (well you have done so and made an ass of yourself)?

    There are tons of people here that are saying wipe out the entire Middle East...

    And I have no doubts about your life... It barks, wags its tail, looks like a dog, then it is a dog.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 06:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 140 ElaineB

    I nearly put Business Class / First Class due to the financial jiggery pokery that airlines get up to on certain routes, but heh, if it helps you to believe what you claim, be my guest.

    “True but not the senate and that doesn't indicate my employment.”

    But it does indicate your “level” of importance to the American government. Nobody at that level is a nobody: or do you consider yourself a nobody?

    “And….
    I was referring to your new best friend:”

    CD2 does have some very valid points, you harping on about guns just makes you look like one of the seven members of the deadheaded ‘Snowdrop Committee’ who managed to remove pistols from 52,000 of us and put automatic firearms in the hands of black gangsters: that was a result, NOT.

    If you want to learn the truth about Dunblane and the despicable Northern Constabulary read Lord Dennings Report on the matter and educate yourself.

    And finally:
    “I have no problem with anyone disagreeing with me.”

    If ONLY that were the case.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 06:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @148

    “I nearly put Business Class / First Class due to the financial jiggery pokery that airlines get up to on certain routes, but heh, if it helps you to believe what you claim, be my guest.

    “True but not the senate and that doesn't indicate my employment.”

    But it does indicate your “level” of importance to the American government. ”

    So now you DO believe my statements and are not accusing me of lying. O.K.

    I was asking CD2 why he needs so many guns. It is a valid question and I am sure he has a valid reason. In Argentina I can believe the need.

    This is a message board where people debate. It really is OK for people to disagree. The insults and personal attacks just lower the level,

    @147

    “There are tons of people here that are saying wipe out the entire Middle East… ” Where is 'here'? Argentina? This message board?

    I have told you I really don't care what you think of my life or my work but your obsession with it is perplexing.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 06:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    It’s not that we care what you do in your private life… It’s what you truly represent and you stand by, that is the problem Elaine.

    Elaine if you had a private employer you would have said so years ago.
    You are clearly dont.

    If you work for the World Bank or any of those you are still a bureaucrat on the taxpayer’s pay roll-

    You have being in Boehner’s office… That flight you mentioned was from Chile to none other than Washington DC near Christmas last year, who does that in business world?? Nahh... It’s also your job to survey and pick up the [political] opinions of Argentines on this board and elsewhere. What the hell for would a private want that for unless it’s for polling numbers and stuff like that… Like Pew research center, Gallup, etc but after you said there is less than 50000 extremist worldwide and your complete lack of knowledge in statistic matters, makes me completely erase the possibility.

    You have left far too many evidence along the way. You can’t turn back on it now.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 07:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @150 “that is the problem Elaine.”

    It is only a problem for you, not me,

    “Elaine if you had a private employer you would have said so years ago.
    You are clearly dont. ”

    Who do you work for?

    “You have being in Boehner’s office” True.

    I have flown numerous times to D.C., NYC, Santiago, Buenos Aires, Chicago, Miami and probably another 40 - 50 destinations all over the world. It proves nothing other than I travel a lot.

    “You have left far too many evidence along the way. You can’t turn back on it now.”

    Evidence? Of travel? Yes, I travel a lot for work and pleasure. Between 6 and 7 months every year.

    So, what is your job and who do you work for?

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 08:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I said “Elaine if you had a private employer you would have said so years ago.
    You are clearly dont. ”

    You reply
    Who do you work for?

    So you work for the government.

    Dish that out.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 08:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @152 Your silly little jibes are pointless. Believe whatever you like because you will never know the nature of my work.

    In general, does anyone know what anyone does for a living on this board? I don't as it is irrelevant.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 08:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    Now we ARE getting bogged down.
    Please lets not get TOO personal.
    We can argue/debate all day.
    But as muslims generally refuse to assimilate,
    or will assimilate on THEIR terms only,
    lt is glaringly obvious that we would not have this problem if there had been NO MUSLIM immigration in the first place.
    What on earth were the pc crowd thinking????????
    Or is there another reason that they will not tell us?
    Thanks ChrisR, you are indeed a friend.
    @136 HansNiesund,
    l see, but for all his rantings against ElaineB, he has got some valid points.
    Credit where its due, l always say.
    l agree with him that far too many people cannot or willnot see the danger in our midst.
    When my family lived in lndonesia, Christian churches were being torched by radical muslims & Christians were being killed.
    The government's response was pathetic.
    When, however the Christians defended themselves(& began killing muslims) the government fell upon the Christians like a ton of bricks & everything was hushed up. So l have experienced “peaceful” lslam with myself .
    We should not let this violent, inhumane, despicable religion divide us on here.
    We have enough other things to worry about, lol!

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    154

    I'm sorry but the Muslims are not the problem, Muslims understand the laguage that is spoken out of the barrel of a gun...Just as they were in Poitiers, Navas de Tolosa, Malta, Lepanto, Vienna and so on.

    The real ultimate problem is the PC gang and the establishment class running the States of Europe. Wait and see and it will all unfold.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    l agree, PC crowd is a HUGE problem,
    They over-regulate industry also,
    We need a PC-Free homogenous society,
    Homogenous in mentality, not race.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I just feel its either going to end with massive amounts of kool aid, prozac and anesthesia for the disenfranchised peoples of Europe ( the wealthiest will leave) and the Caliphate is implemented gradually and progressively in time or something really bad happens and the Europeans loose all their patience and the gloves are off. In the last case the Elites are guillotined and the Muslims chased back to Gibraltar and Marseille and swim across back to North Africa.

    I dont see any middle way this is going to end.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @156

    I think you're right about mentality. Extremist nutters the world over have pretty much the same mentality. They don't recognise each other because the they've got the idea that's its the flavour of extremism that's important, rather than the mentality that drives it. They all deserve each other, in my view, but it's difficult to imagine a humane way to corall them altogether in the same place and just let them get on with it.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    And that is where and why you have already lost. When you recognize Marine Le Pen as a symptom of the problem, and that she was correct all along instead of an extremist and have a civilized honest and frank discussion you may have a chance… until then you are a PC extremist yourself, functional to Islam and the State elites.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 09:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @159
    When Le Pen wins, the jihadis win. Nothing they'd like better.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 10:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    The Jihadists are already winning. 20 decades of Neville Chamberlain's governments have miserably failed and the problem is getting worse and worse. What part of that dont you understand?? Most of that time her father and her party where a fringe lonely voice in French politics. Why did they become popular now??

    Its because your PC crap has FAILED OVER AND OVER. If you continue YOU WILL BE DEFEATED.

    The state class, the clueless people that say its all peaches and cream there is only 50.000 extremist world wide is the ideology that governs Europe, Im not saying go and kill them, but they have to be urgently and systematically removed from all forms of government and power, time is running out.

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 10:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    161 CabezaDura2

    “Most of that time her father and her party where a fringe lonely voice in French politics. Why did they become popular now?? Its because your PC crap has FAILED OVER AND OVER. If you continue YOU WILL BE DEFEATED. ”

    So........ and let me guess this correct, what you are saying is that the French National Party has become popular BECAUSE of English PC crap???

    and that, if we continue, we will be defeated??? By who?? the French National Party?? Neville Chamberlain's governments? ( who has in no way, shape or form. been in power for 20 decades champ. )

    You might want to do a little more research before penning a rant such as this. You might want to wipe that froth from your mouth and try again.

    Love and hugs

    You really need to sort yourself out

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 11:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Im talking about the same mentality and ruling classes that has being running Europe for decades, since the end of WW2.

    Are you really that daft??

    Jan 10th, 2015 - 11:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @162

    Apparently in order to defend Western values against the EekAMuslim! menace, we're supposed to abandon Western values and give the EekAMuslim! menace exactly it wants. I don't quite get it myself.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 12:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    British liberals are the most utterly stupid people there is in the world here is the reason why

    This is why Piers Morgan Vs Larry Elder
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vK5UkZrPcc

    A whole BBC Studio full of liberals vs Tommy Robinson
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6vK5UkZrPcc

    And of course HamasNiesund, Elaine and all the sort of creatures and things that are in denial. Until they wipe them out they are doomed… just as they say with the peronists of Argentina.

    Just plane retarded people

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 05:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @165

    It's getting stale. When do we get to the EekAWoman! rant? There's usually one of them after the EekAMuslim! rant.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 06:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @166 LOL @ 165. I am a 'liberal' and some kind of creature. He cannot help himself, he is a misogynist to his tiny toes.

    He attacks me personally just because I don't agree with him How is he any different to Islamic extremists? They attack people for not agreeing with their version of the truth. He should think about that.

    There is not a snowballs chance in hell of The West becoming swept away by the Islamic State. But CD2 plays nicely into the hand of terrorists by whipping up fear. Exactly what they want.

    CD2 You can stop worrying. The West will never cede our democratic ways in the face of the minority of Islamic extremists. We will continue to live freely. We won't and can't be safe all the time because we live freely. That is the price of democracy.

    Meantime, how is that escalating crime in Argentina? How is that rampant inflations? These are very real problems you are facing every single day.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 09:55 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • malicious bloke

    Western enlightenment values will neuter the crazy end of Mohammedanism the same way it neutered the inquisitors and witch-hunters among the Jesusite crowd.

    We still have millions of christians living in our lands but we more-or-less forced them to grow up. I see no reason why the wiggy end of Islam can't be treated the same way.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 12:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    168. And how many centuries, wars, French Revolutions and blood did it take for the Catholics and the Vatican to be dismantled?? It was definitely not a case of passive assimilation by any standard.

    Your analogy proves you wrong right from the start when you look at the actual history.

    Then they relied on the “Green Ford Falcon” just as the Argies

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 12:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @169 How are the Death Squads used to terrify the Argentine people into submission any different to Islamic terrorists attempting (and failing) to use fear to get the British people to submit? You advocate the use of terrorism.

    Fortunately, the British people are made of sterner stuff. We won't give up democracy in the face of terrorism. The IRA tried it and failed.

    Is that the root of your interest in this subject, CD2? The Argentines submitted to a dictatorship and have lived in decline and chaos every since. They have never really recovered from needing someone else to tell them what to do and rely heavily on the government to support them. Are you hoping the British will similarly submit? You will have a very long wait if that is the case.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 01:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @170
    I just don’t get. What is wrong with you, what are you talking about?? You are delusional

    The IRA didn’t want to impose a equivalent of SHARIA in London, it didn’t want to overthrow cultural order in the UK and impose its own… The Green Book had not even one but not one reference to Catholicism. There stated objective was Northern Ireland and get UK out of it.

    You are already on fast track to becoming an Orwellian police State along with the rest of Europe!! Don’t come to me with this democracy BS freedom bla bla bla it’s the least you want…Specially government cronies like yourself.

    How conversation with lefties always end...

    -Why I’ a racist ??
    -Because you are
    -But why I’m I a racist
    -Because you are a racist
    -Please explain why I’m a racist…
    - You are a racist

    ”How are the Death Squads used to terrify the Argentine people into submission any different to Islamic terrorists attempting (and failing) to use fear to get the British people to submit?”

    How many years have you lived in Palermo for?? How many trips around Argentina?? How many UK taxpayers money have you wasted here and don’t know anything about what you are talking about not even close… No, and don’t tell me you do because you don’t.

    You need to be sacked.

    But I offer and alternative to all this...Two State Solution!!!!..After all you recognized Palestine, -Sweden, UK, and France (about too)- and thats what your NGOs keep on telling the Israelis to do, no??

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 01:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @167

    All the same, life must be grim with 860 million imaginary enemies. That could poison anybody's outlook.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @171 You are rambling again.

    The truth is Argentines were terrified into living under a dictatorship. It will never happen in the U.K. Not ever. We don't scare so easily. We are not easily indoctrinated because we are taught to question and to think independently; Something that drives you to distraction.

    It is obvious from you alarmist posts that fear runs quickly and deep in your Argentine mind.

    What about all that crime in Argentina? Is that why you keep all those guns? It must be terrifying for you.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    No that is not the truth. Argentines during the 1970s were vastly in support of Videla and the culling of infiltrated communist terrorist from Cuba who were causing havoc. Elaine shut you don’t know anything you were paid for years to do ears dropping here in sites, lived here amongst us and you are clueless.

    “It will never happen in the U.K” I already said you are becoming an Orwellian Super State.
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/terrorism-in-the-uk/11323558/Anti-terror-plan-to-spy-on-toddlers-is-heavy-handed.html

    The equation of 1 potential terrorist spyed by 20 agents.
    Euro birth rates 1.1- 1.6.
    Muslim birth rates 3.0-3.5
    70% of Muslims worldwide support Sharia law

    That is enough for a logical common sense person to realize there is something profoundly wrong and that a cultural clash is inevitable. But you dont get along with facts, common sense numbers and statistics...But how could you?? You are a government bureaucrat.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @174

    Let me see if I've got this right.

    In order to defend our Western democratic values aganst your 860 million imaginary EekAMuslim! enemies, it's undemocratic to be reinforcing the intelligence services, and we should be adopting the Ford Falcon and electrode instead?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    No, have not got it right. You are an idiot

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    That's quite possible. I've struggled with Malvinista logic all the time I've been here, and now I see that Breivikistas use the same.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    This is a pretty good start
    http://www.minutodigital.com/2015/01/08/por-un-manifiesto-contra-el-islam-en-europa/

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @178
    Not really. It's just another EekAMuslim! site, only this time in Spanish.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Yeah you are a stupid troll... Have you seeing that more than half of Germany (57%) see Islam as a threat and 40% of Germans feel like foreigners in their own country and 24% will veto futher Muslim immigration ??

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @174 My ears haven't dropped at all and I won't shut up because you don't like what I say. You cannot intimidate me, I am British.

    You supported Death Squads to get rid of Cubans and now your President is one of Fidel Castro's best friends. How do you explain that?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 02:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @181

    But what part dont you understand that you are WRONG and are clueless of what you are talking about, vieja ñoqui gagá...???

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @182 No I am not wrong at all. You just don't like what I say. I show you up for what you are and you don't like it.

    You are an Argentine man running scared. I don't scare so easily as I am a British woman.

    You said you supported the Death Squad. Are you proud of that?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    You are completely clueless of what you are saying. Everything they tought you about 1976 is a lie and is wrong. That guy Massot who is an exile in Canada would have easily commanded a fire squad and killed my family.

    “You are an Argentine man running scared. I don't scare so easily as I am a British woman” LOL!!!.... I think that you are shitless scared. That is what you have actually being saying to me over and over... That is what your attitude feeding the crocodile to be eaten last.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @184 No I am not fear mongering like you. I am completely confident in the British people and the inability of anyone to take away our freedom and democracy.

    Over one million people marching in unity in Paris today. That must really annoy you. It doesn't look like the French will roll over either.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    185.
    57% of Germans think Islam is a threat, its not some random Argentine inventing stuff. Elaine I have nothing around me exept for country side, Islam will never be significant in Argentina. And Im armed.

    You on the other hand are indeed shitless scared. I know a lot of psycology, and you really are a basic person, despite all you really are and I can tell.
    If you dont get to see the whole thing falling appart is because you are old already... You are already becoming a police state!!! Why dont you admit this

    Elaine if I had to count all the times you went off tangent on me I should be a millionare

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Elaine I see the Nazi is still crouching in his shack somewhere stroking his guns scared and trembling. People like that who rely on what they Google for information are truly pathetic. They dont realise the power of the media to distort facts. Strength to you for standing up to the pathetic insults and bullying. We all remember that these were the same people that we defeated so comprehensively in 1982, they just ran away when tbe chips were down. A bunch of puffed up cowards actually. Racists, closet Nazis and clearly mysoginists. Cant be bothered with argueing with them.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @186 LOL! You and TTT are peas in a pod. When defeated in argument and when he knows he is proved wrong he always resorts to “but I'm alright, Jack” statements, just like you. Your country could burn but you live in the countryside and you have guns, so you will be O.K.

    You cling to one poll statistics but German people are marching in Paris today for unity, freedom and democracy. You cannot accept it can you.

    Maybe that is the difference. When challenged, we think about the created good and out society. When challenged you take care of yourself and don't care about your countrymen.

    But what does it matter to you anyway? You just keep an armed guard on your remote home because it is only a matter of time before your own countrymen attempt to rob you. People are running out of money, food, basic supplies. It will be dog-eat-dog in Argentina before long.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Thickheaded/Pauly http://thesundaytimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article4319349.ece?CMP=SOC-appshare-198850-em-and-2.1

    Suck on that. Comprehensively duffed up by a woman. Must hurt for a mysoginist..

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    In regards to my safety Im actually all right.... So why would I be scared, its you the one who brought it up so why are you fussing ?? Yes the economy is terrible I know more about it than you do. So?? Can you actually stick to a point just about on anything??

    “people are marching in Paris today for unity, freedom and democracy. You cannot accept it can you.”
    Where did you get that from?? I have anything against the marches. But they are open interpretation and just 700.000 ppl in Paris. 57% of Germans that think Islam is a threat is over 46 million people.
    There is no open interpretation there.

    Thats how it works.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    Its not, you dont know what you are talking about. Gosh, your screename says it all. Thick Headed..

    This is how it works… .
    http://thesundaytimes.co.uk/tto/opinion/columnists/article4319349.ece?CMP=SOC-appshare-198850-em-and-2.1

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 03:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    191. Piss off troll

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    You are not going to to like this, CD2, but leading the march of over one million people in Paris today are King Abdullah II of Jordan - a direct descendant of the prophet Muhammah and Israel's Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu. Walking together with Christians, Atheists, Germans, English … all showing unity against terrorism. Jews and Muslims walking side by side.

    We will never cede our democracy and freedom to anyone so you need to get your excitement elsewhere.

    @187 Yeah, he is a tiresome fascist but exchanges with him show him up for what he is. He can't help revealing himself to everyone. We now know he supports death squads. What a lovely chap.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Bahahahaahahaaha

    BUT THEY ARE FUCKING POLITICIANS, dumbarse LOL!!! With each one of them in Paris with their own agenda!!!! God you really, really are so naive !!! Even the Shi'a Iranian backed terror groups Hamas & Hezbollah have said that the attack on Charlie Hebdo was wrong!!! They are still terrorists!

    http://www.state.gov/j/ct/rls/crt/2011/195553.htm

    That is why I said OPEN INTEPRETATION.... There is no Open interpretation with the statement “Islam is a threat” that 46 million germans subscribe too.

    “Walking together with Christians, Atheists, Germans, English … all showing unity against terrorism. Jews and Muslims walking side by side.”

    LOL !!!!!What do you want to win a Miss Universe contest giving a World piece speech ????

    These PC gangs are so so clueless about everything... You are a bunch of hopeless and useless idiots.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    I must say that when certain Germans start holding torchlit processions to demand actions against the adherents of particular religious persuasion, I start to get a little antsy, but I can see why it would go down well in Argentina.

    But I have plenty faith in the Germans, who unlike Argentines are entirely capable of coming to terms with their past. Hell will freeze over before the Falcons and electrodes make the appearance over there.

    And of course, the anti-Pegida demonstrations are much bigger than the Pegida ones. This might be because 87.35% of Germans regularly eat currywurst, at least once a month. It's true, I read it on the Internet.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @194 Really? Over one million people and they are all politicians? Fool. They are interviewing random people in the crowd. They are from all walks of life, different faiths, different countries and they all march united against terrorism. 40 World Leaders. The Israeli Prime Minister with the Palestinian President walking together.

    It upsets you to know that we cannot be beaten by a small number of extremists. We are not used to losing in the way you are, I guess.

    @195 You are right that the Germans have a mature attitude to their past. There will always be an unsavoury element in all free countries. It is the price of democracy. We don't have to agree with them but defend their right to say it.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    196. The leader of the largest political party in France was banned from attending, the one that has the largest vote count in the last elections. So it means nothing. You can put the slogan on the protest, which ever you want. You nor the politicians can speak for the people in Paris.

    You want to intepret this as peaches and cream and “la la land” I guess its in your right to be naive.

    But I'm not naive.

    Anyone can see the Euro politicians and Arab crackpots have just hijacked the movilizations, and you can pretty much intepret anything from it since then.

    #JeSuisCharlie - But You're Not
    http://www.steynonline.com/6742/jesuischarlie-but-youre-not

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    Anyyway, surely it's about time we stopped wasting our energy on the imaginary 850 million strong EekAMuslim! horde, and turned our attention to the real threat. Has nobody ever noticed that wherever you go, anywhere in the world, there is an Irish pub, a pizzeria and a Chinese takeaway? And thry're all Catholics? (except the Chinese. So they claim). What's that all about?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @197 As a supporter of death squads I am sure you want to dismiss the Unity March as meaningless. It is all too civilised for you isn't it? No one to torture?

    The division you crave is not going to happen. In fact it is likely to unite everyone even more against the terrorists.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 04:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    199.

    Laughed at, owned, ridiculed and off tangent again...??

    Sigh...

    Lovely day out here I shouldn't be spending it wasting time with PC cowardly nutters that will never get it and are in profound denial. I’m tired of winning these debates.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 05:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @200 You have never won a debate here. Probably why you are a gun-loving, death-squad loving, misogynist, fascist. Desperate to feel important.

    But, please, don't stay here a moment longer. You won't be missed.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 05:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    201.
    “Probably why you are a gun-loving, death-squad loving, misogynist, fascist.”

    Yes I’m suuuuuuuuuuuuuch a naughty boy

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 05:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 201 ElaineB

    I think you need to visit your recent posts before deciding who 'lost'.

    Sorry, Isolde, I promised myself I wouldn't post again. :o(

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 05:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    201 ElaineB

    “Probably why you are a gun-loving, death-squad loving, misogynist, fascist”

    and I'll bet he owns a Ford Falcon as well......................

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 07:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @204 In green?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 07:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    The poor chap is consumed by fear and sexual anxiety. He probably has a Hummer, but only a poster.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 07:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @203 ChrisR,
    lts OK, ChrisR, l have been quietly observing this interesting dialogue, without posting either.
    CD2 has been getting more & more frustrated & begun tying himself in knots.
    And getting too personal with insults etc. No need for that.
    As l said before, he has many(not all)good points, but is under relentless attack from the PC Crowd & is starting to lose it.
    They are even putting words in his mouth.
    Asking if he has a green Ford Falcon for example.
    l imagine this is the sort of rubbish that Winston Churchill had to put up with from the appeasers in the British establishment in the 1930s when he repeatedly warned about German re-armament.
    And he was right on the money.
    Oh well, time will tell.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 08:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    207 lsolde

    I wouldn't describe myself as part of the “PC crowd” but it is amusing to watch CD2 getting himself all tied up in knots and lashing out at everyone and anyone......

    I too think that he has some ( badly put across ) points but what ever they are, they are drowned out by his EekAMuslim! rantings.

    By the way, I don't think you mean the “PC crowd”, here is a video that will explain the difference AND also the dangers you face these days when you cry EekAMuslim!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WXW-Ezs7fRo

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 08:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @207 Yes, him calling me a whore, amongst other things, was really too far. His usual 'bitch' just slides by. His wild stab in the dark trying to get me to reveal my profession is amateurish and never going to work. It doesn't stop him assuming and showering me with insults about what he thinks I do. (He could never comprehend it anyway).

    CD2 brought up the Green Ford Falcon. He said it was the way to deal with things. Really? Death Squads? I listen to all opinions whether I agree with them or not but I won't 'shut up' just because someone doesn't agree with me and he repeatedly tells me to do. CD2 is a grown man with a big mouth. He can dish it out and will have to take the rebuttals.

    The funny part in all this is that no one that knows me in real life would call me P.C. and neither would they call me a bigot. I will not be swept up in a wave of Islamophobia. It is not the solution. It plays directly into the hands of the terrorists and I am more than pleased that the majority feels the same way.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 08:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @207

    The Green Ford Falcon was first mentioned by Cabeza Dura 2 in post @42:

    “Sure in hell, throwing people off planes and taking folks fora ride in a Green Falcon stopped communism in Argentina for 20 years”

    The thing is that Winston Churchil knew his and opposed it. Cabeza and his ilk have no clue abut theirs, and favour it.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 08:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @210 And when he didn't get enough of a reaction he brought up the Green Ford Falcons again.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 08:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    209 ElaineB

    “His wild stab in the dark trying to get me to reveal my profession is amateurish and never going to work.”

    There was this English chap, a few years ago now who said that:-

    “ For every action, there is an equal and opposite re-action”

    Engineers and Physicists have picked up on it and use the phrase quite a lot these days....perhaps CD2 should bear it in mind when he is ranting on this forum.

    After all, the chance of getting something completely right goes hand in hand with the chance of getting something completely wrong......

    Just a thought........

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Hey tooold… what is your problem with me???… I’m asking you because the only thing you have to say against me is that nurseries are not called kindergartens in the UK. WTF?? Then you go and post a link of none other than Pat Condell (whom I’m subscribed too) on his rants!! ??? Posted by this channel

    https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCmkrI4U29fhNTIsq3XMza9w

    … I don’t think Pat Condel would be on Elaine and Hamas’s side at all if he actually read this thread.

    Are you insane?? Or just being bitchy??

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 09:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @213 Why do their have to be sides? It is not the school yard. Is it the 'you are with us or against us' mentality of nationalist thinking?

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 09:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Get real. You and I don’t agree with each other aren't we polar opposite sides??

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @215 We disagree on this subject, true. But I don't try to round up a group to be on my side to support my opinion. That is the difference.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    213 CabezaDura2

    “what is your problem with me???…Are you insane?? Or just being bitchy??”

    Well there is that, the insults you throw out casually to anyone who has the affront to have their own opinion. Your hatred towards anyone who does not agree with you, your lack of empathy AND your complete lack of maths skills.

    If I may quote so that we can all be sure:-

    From post 161:-

    “20 decades of Neville Chamberlain's governments have miserably failed and the problem is getting worse and worse. ”

    20 decades yeah? Decade = 10 years so we are talking about 20 x 10 yeah? so 200 years??

    Next, this little gem from post 163

    “Im talking about the same mentality and ruling classes that has being running Europe for decades, since the end of WW2. ”

    End of World War 2?? 1945 to 2015???

    That's 70 years. Hardly the “20 decades” of which you speak.

    Back to school for you CD2 ( or should that be “kindergarten”???? )

    So, the question you should be asking is

    ”what is your problem with everyone else on this forum???

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    All Im saying is its really odd to quote none other than Pat Condell, he will never be on the side of someone like yourself on this issue. And neither would I.
    Care less.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @218

    Oh, I thought of something we agree on. I also like green cars, though not driven by death squads.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    217
    So ?? Do you know the amount of abuse I’ve being getting.
    No old, I think you that im a fairly reasonable and educated guy that can put up an argument.

    I know when WW2 ended I know who Neville Chamberlain was and I think it goes unsaid what I meant by “Neville Chambarlain” governments. Easy going, preach multiculturalism, look at the other side, feed the crocodile hoping it would eat them last, and notice I was referring them to the whole of Europe. In some parts of Europe like France they arrived as almost as soon as they expropriated our lands and kicked us out after the French Republic betray us. In other places of Europe they arrived in the 70s, but the dust was swept more or less in the early 90s and mass immigration started then.

    I think a lot of the things that I have said like the green falcon go un said.
    If the Security services have them already profiled, just go ahead and do it quickly, swiftly and don’t make a noise. Like pretty much every intelligence service does in the world and like Henry Kissinger told Cesar Guzzetti Videla’s foreing Minister.
    Just hurry up get the job done with quickly and swiftly, because the US congress will start putting pressure on us to isolate you and they will never understand the fight against communism.
    And Henry Kissinger DID a lot to win the cold war for capitalism and the USA, now it’s your turn to do the dirty work.

    If you are a worlds person with your feet on the ground (you can travell a lot and be a turist expert but not have a clue of what is going on) and you are old as you say you are and smart enough you would know that the world is not a nice place, its far from pefect and there is a lot of dirty work that needs to be done by some like forensic docs, cleaning sewers, prison guards (like Conq) and stuff like that

    But then again a lot of this is just over the top explanation, because you do agree with what Im saying, but you have a problem with me, which is fine by me. But at least say so man

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    218 CabezaDura2

    “he will never be on the side of someone like yourself on this issue.”

    Ha, ha, ha, ha!!!!!! So you know what I think now do you?

    Your conceit is breathtaking.

    How would YOU know who someone “like yourself” is??? let alone what I think?

    Anyone who presumes to think that they know me and what I think from this forum is either so far up his own a*s that they can't see daylight or is a complete retard, clutching at straws..... and I think I know which one you are.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Yeo I knew it you had no point to make but you have a problem with me.

    I was not talking about you, YOU IDIOT!!!, I was talking about Pat Condell!!!!! Never mind you are just another one. Shoot yourself in the balls. Care less.
    -----------------------------------------------------------------
    @220
    For archives sakes

    According to the memcon's verbatim transcript, Secretary of State Kissinger interrupted the Foreign Minister's report on the situation in Argentina and said “Look, our basic attitude is that we would like you to succeed. I have an old-fashioned view that friends ought to be supported. What is not understood in the United States is that you have a civil war. We read about human rights problems but not the context. The quicker you succeed the better… The human rights problem is a growing one. Your Ambassador can apprise you. We want a stable situation. We won't cause you unnecessary difficulties. If you can finish before Congress gets back, the better. Whatever freedoms you could restore would help.”

    One day earlier, on October 6, 1976, Admiral Guzzetti had been told by Acting Secretary of State Charles W. Robinson “that it is possible to understand the requirement to be tough.” But Robinson also remarked on the “question of timing of the relaxation of extreme countersubversion measures” before Congress voted sanctions on Argentina. The memcon with Robinson goes on to note that “[t]he Acting Secretary said… The problem is that the United States is an idealistic and moral country and its citizens have great difficulty in comprehending the kinds of problems faced by Argentina today. There is a tendency to apply our moral standards abroad and Argentina must understand the reaction of Congress with regard to loans and military assistance. The American people, right or wrong, have the perception that today there exists in Argentina a pattern of gross violations of human rights.”

    http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB104/

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @217
    “So ?? Do you know the amount of abuse I’ve being getting.”

    Oh you poor thing. Have you been getting what you've been trying to dish out? Life is so terribly unfair. And all you've been doing is stand up for torture, murder,
    racism, and misogyny.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 10:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @222 And to put further more the record straight the cold war was not won by John Paul the II, R. Reagan & Thatcher.

    It was won and fought by governments like the ones of Videla and Pinochet in Latam, the Apartheid soldiers in Angola destroying wave after wave of communists of Cuba, the Mujahedeen in Afghanistan ( that will later divide and one branch forming the Taliban) and so many other very “undesirables” by today’s politically correct standards.

    Anybody who fails to see history as it really is deludes himself.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    222 CabezaDura2

    “Yeo I knew it you had no point to make but you have a problem with me.”

    No you don't. You don't know......... It's pointless even trying. You don't even know yourself!!!

    I think that the others on hear deserve a medal for deciphering your inane ramblings in to some sort of debatable point so stop with the “I knew it you had no point to make” s**t. You are not fooling anyone here, well, unless it's yourself ( but that doesn't count ).

    Now go and polish your Ford Falcon.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @224

    Reading between the lines, it seems to me that the claim that Admiral Guzzetti did heard exactly what it was he wanted to hear is entirely plausible. This would also be entirely consistent with the astounding mixture of incompetence and brutality that characterised the Argentine military of the time. Kissinger no doubt, was well aware that were was no point in attempting to appeal to the better instincts of a bunch of sadists and perverts, and was trying to coax them gently towards a semblance of civilized behaviour.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @225
    Are you coming to Argentina anytime soon??? I can pick you up at the airport ......in my Green Ford Falcon... You will have the ride of your life. Don’t worry its very well kept, mechanics fine, and refurbished inside and taken the old leather work that had blood in it and placed brand new covers. Now with a brand new Stereo with new loud speakers to play music (I love old Prussian military marches) really high so people can’t hear what we are “discussing” about inside the cabin of the car. Tinted windows... You (we) are going to have lots of fun. Un schedule and un classified destination. Ohh there is more than enough room for you too Hamas!

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @224 You know all about handing out abuse, you can hardly play the victim card.

    You are a strange one. Your grasp of history peculiar. But you cannot hide who you really are. You are misogynist, racist, bigoted and a thoroughly unpleasant man.

    That aside I can still agree or disagree with points you make. I don't disagree with you because of your flawed character but because I don't agree with the point you are making. Likewise, if I agree with you on something I will say so regardless of your character or past offensive comments.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Im sure enough guilty of all those things and many more in your own politically correct bubble Elaine.

    However something I never do is play the victim game. That is surely your expertise.

    Ohhh and newsflash, I couldn't care less what you or other think about me and the way I think.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @229 “However something I never do is play the victim game. ” You just did @220.

    By any reasonable person's standard you are a thoroughly unpleasant person.

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I just said the truth; I have being getting a lot of abuse just as other posters have said.... in any case it was tooold that was playing the victim when I simply asked him if he was being bitchy. What have you being doing here all afternoon being butthurt all 3 of you. Anyway I don’t care.

    “By any reasonable person's standard you are a thoroughly unpleasant person.”
    Well the Catholic conservative old ladies, I drive too when I go to mass on early Sundays ( no I never miss one) in my green falcon are delighted with me and adore me. They love my mustache too

    Jan 11th, 2015 - 11:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @224

    It's pretty amazing to learn how the cold war was “won and fought by governments like the ones of Videla”. I hardly knew that the Russians were stopped at Berlin by Argentina's courageous electrocution, shooting, and airdrop of a few thousand students, nuns, and trade unionists.

    “Anybody who fails to see history as it really is deludes himself.”
    Now there's a thought.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    You know, you’re over dependency on editing and spinning every comment and word I say (which is typical amongst you guys) is getting a bit sickening and tiresome. Because ultimately none of you guys debate with a shred of honesty.

    “And to put further more the record straight the cold war was not won by John Paul the II, R. Reagan & Thatcher.

    It was won and fought by governments like the ones of Videla and Pinochet in Latam, the Apartheid soldiers in Angola destroying wave after wave of communists of Cuba, the Mujahedeen in Afghanistan ( that will later divide and one branch forming the Taliban) and so many other very “undesirables” by today’s politically correct standards.

    Anybody who fails to see history as it really is deludes himself.”

    Yes I totally to that subscribe and rest my case. Get It loser??

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 02:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @208 toooldtodieyoung,
    @209 ElaineB,
    @210HansNiesund,
    Yes you are correct, CD2 brought up the Green Falcon first.
    My apologies.
    l had read your comments at 204 & 205 & thought that you were ganging up on him because he(like me)thinks that muslim immigration is/was a very bad thing for any western country.
    l still do & cannot understand the mentality of those who think it good for western nations.
    l fail to see ANY benefits, but DO see many, many problems in the future.
    What happened in Paris is just the beginning.
    l can feel it in my bones & l have never failed yet. l just hope that l'm wrong.
    Blessed be, Peace.
    @233 CabezaDura2,
    You've damaged your case enough here, Jack.
    Please do not be rude or insulting & maybe people will listen to what you have to say.
    You have some good points but you have to learn to put them over without putting people offside.
    lt just makes people clam up & they won't listen to your points which is a great pity if in fact they ARE good points.
    Peace

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 09:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @233 Is that what they teach you in the Southern Cone? Wow. No wonder you have such a skewed view of the world. You haven't made a case at all, not one that anyone would believe.

    I am beginning to understand some of your frustration and the bitterness that pours out of your posts. You live under a government all cosied up to the communist Cubans and Venezuelans (run by Cuba). It must be tough for you to swallow.

    CD2, let me help you. If you put a comment, any comment, on a message board it is open to interpretation, criticism, scrutiny and debate. This is not a platform for bigoted monologues. And why not think before you post. You put some clearly inaccurate and outrageous statements on here and expect people to accept them without question. It is never going to happen so exercise a little restraint, hold onto your temper and post something rational.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 09:29 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CaptainSilver

    9/11 was a beginning. This time it was Frances turn. There will be more attrocities like this, they are difficult and very expensive to prevent. If it isnt Muslim fanatics it will be some other fanatics. The gunpowder plot, the assasination of Franz Ferdinand and Martin Luther King and countless others throughout history. As the most sensible folk have suggested the best course of action is to recognise the threat and do our best to neutralize it. The stupid thing to do is to heed the voice of unreason, racism and facism exemplified by Thickheaded, just a greasy mustacioed idiot toting guns to boost his ego and swanning around in what he thinks is a cool set of wheels. Big on Googled facts, short on interlect and reasoned argument.
    4 million who took to the streets in France is just the tip of the iceberg. Anyone who thinks a few terrorists of whatever religious persuasion is going to overwhelm Europeans A - knows nothing about Europe, B - has no reasoning powers worth diddly squat C - is probably an Argentinian paid stooge or Troll. Definately not worth answering and should be consigned to the dustbin like Toby/Think/Voice etc…

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 09:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @234 Apology accepted. No hard feelings at all.

    I have said on this message board on several occasions that I think the immigration policy under Blairs government was flawed. I also believe we have not handled integration well and other countries have handled it better, the US and Australia, for example. Other countries have done a worse job, France is a good example.They ghettoised immigrants and prejudice is alive and well there. I hope this positive reaction to the recent atrocity will prevail.

    Britain had been built on immigration and each wave of a specific group of immigrants has been met with prejudice and suspicion. Muslims have been settling in Britain for 300 years though the majority in the latter half of the last century. The majority are integrated and make a useful contribution to society. And that is the key.

    @236 You make a good point about fanatics. Terrorists are and always will be in existence looking for a situation to exploit to feed their lust for power. On a low grade level you only have to look at some of the posters here to see there are armchair racists and malcontents easily stirred but it is the angry, bitter, young people feeling rejected by society that we really need to watch.

    JMO

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 10:47 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @234 Isolde

    Like Elaine above I agree with you more than may be readily apparent in the “discussion” with CD2. Only a fool would argue that immigration hasn't caused social problems, some of them immense. But I start to part company with the likes of Cabeza with the simple observation that at root we are all Jack Tamson's bairns, as the Scots say. Most people just want to get on with their lives, put food on the table, and bring up their kids. There is a certain irreducible proportion of assholes in any group for whom this isn't good enough, and in certain cases local conditions allow them to get off the leash. It's happened in Argentina, it's happened big time in Germany, in Russia, in China, pretty much everywhere. But only nutters believe you can eradicate nutters by becoming nutters yourself.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 11:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    234 lsolde

    Don't worry about it Isolde, it is already forgotten.

    “What happened in Paris is just the beginning. l can feel it in my bones & l have never failed yet. l just hope that l'm wrong.”

    I hope you are wrong as well....... Something has changed since Christmas, even the reporting on the BBC has become somewhat “Hysterical” on this subject....... I hope it doesn't point to a gathering storm.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 11:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Isolde

    What is the problem mentioning the “Green Falcon”??

    I’m a logical person, and if I put forth a logical, researched and thought out argument. I’m not a diplomat as you want me to be, nor I have the patience to be.

    If you constantly say to me I have many good points, you must appreciate that those take thought out process, research and logic. That has added value.
    Now “EakEMuslims”, “misogynist”, “racist”, “fascist”, “Islamophobe” taking out of context, looking at things that does not, going off tangent. That is very easy to do and has no added value in it.

    I HAD NOT ONE SINGLE BASED AND THOUGHT ARGUMENT PUT AGAINST ME FOR A WEEK.

    Then I get ocasional people like “toold” that are just bullies because, that is just ganging up and taking sides. Just look at exclusively tooolds conversation for example. He was just rude and stupid, just looking the hind leg off a donkey just to attack me and side with the others.

    Of course I’m going to call them for what they are. Just plane idiots and retards. Because they are just; a bunch of idiots to me at the end.

    Liberals are not interested in discussing nor debating the issue at all they are just bullies and you have just fallen for their pressure.

    Being a conservative means fighting bullies, and this and more has played here.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmhM33GUfV4

    PS. And I will NOT APOLAGISE FOR ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 12:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @240 Oh, no! Are you being bullied? And you told me you never play the victim card. Your exact wards were “However something I never do is play the victim game.”

    “I’m a logical person, and if I put forth a logical, researched and thought out argument.”

    No you don't. You talk complete nonsense most of the time. You can't make a point without insulting. If you think the Argentine version of history is a good reference source then no one will take you seriously.

    “I’m not a diplomat…”

    You got that right. You don't have the necessary qualities.

    Just so you know, several people disagreeing with you is not ganging up, it is several people disagreeing with your point of view. In your case it is bound to happen frequently.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Yes, I am being bullied. That is a statement of fact for me.
    Im not victimizing, if I fight you back the bullies then it means Im not a victim.

    Victimizing would be what Toby does saying he is suffering from racism or whatever. You being a woman, you play the misogyny card almost all the time and you have others that subscribe to that.

    Liberal bullies you shut down the debate, you dont discuss policy, you dont discuss a solution to the problem,
    Re run the whole approach of you guy has always being to try to demonize me as some wacko nazi with fire coming out of my ears.

    That is all there is to you guys.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @242 oh, please. You dish out the offensive remarks without restraint or consideration. You cannot claim to be bullied when you get pulled up on it.

    I call out misogyny when I see it. It is evident in some older men (of a generation) in the U.K. and far more common amongst men in South America. You don't even recognise it unless I point it out to you, so you are learning something.

    Someone disagreeing with your point of view is not 'shutting down the debate' it is the opposite. Whenever one of your statements is challenged you always run away from the debate.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Elaine take for example my @220, @222, @224 comments one is based on US national archieves.

    Your reply was “Is that what they teach you in the Southern Cone? Wow. No wonder you have such a skewed view of the world. You haven't made a case at all, not one that anyone would believe.”

    Again a case of developed, independent research, thought out process of argumentation with a point to it, and all that takes a lot of general knowledge input, just washed aside by the bully on the grounds of “is that what they teach you at the southern cone??” “Wow, what a skewed world view you have Hard head”.

    That is shutting down the debate and being a bully. I know your little tactics and miserable ways, I call it for what it is. But just analyzing them and putting them across each and everytime Elaine is frankly to exhausting.

    So if I choose to call you scum (like I would do to a “man” like Hamas, CaptainSilver, toold or anybody else who plays by those dirty rules) for your dishonesty should I be a misogynist then. Its just great.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @244 See, you can't help yourself. You are incapable of writing any post without insults. If you choose to call me 'scum' you destroy your own credibility.

    You should look up the meaning of misogyny as you still don't seem to understand it. It is probably normal behaviour in your social circle.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 01:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I didn't even call you “scum” I said hipothetically “If I choose to call you scum.....[because of your dishonesty and dirty tactis]” and you are already playing the victim game...

    And we can go by it the whole day Elaine with you guys looking for the 5 leg of a cat at every turn of the corner at every word or comment I say in order to brand me a bigoted, gun loving, violent, extremist, misogynistic, racist. And when all that fails... Hmmm its “the Argentine education system” that indoctrinated me.

    Its no point. Its just a waste of time.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 02:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @246 That you would even consider calling people 'scum' says everything about you. You have said far worse. You called me a 'whore', remember?

    “Its no point. Its just a waste of time”

    Please, don't waste you time.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 02:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @247
    Ohh trust me a lot of people I not only consider in calling scum ( not only here, but in their faces personally) but also actually do so.

    I said you are a GOVERNMENT VIP whore (but you choose to take that part out)... You and your tactics remind me of a certain female president of Argentina. But you consider her NOT to be a government VIP whore and scum. Because you are so politically correct predictable and boring. But your tactics, your dishonesty, your ways... they all come down to the same.

    I have no problems with female street sex workers. I think they have far more dignity. In fact I think I wouldn't even dare be rude to them.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 02:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @248

    ”Ohh trust me a lot of people I not only consider in calling scum ( not only here, but in their faces personally) but also actually do so. “

    That is nothing to be proud of, it just shows you up as a very unpleasant person.

    ”I said you are a GOVERNMENT VIP whore “

    The use of the word 'whore' in this context shows your misogynist nature. You can't understand it as it is normal behaviour for you, like calling people 'scum' to their face. And 'government VIP' is supposition but does reveal your low self-esteem. Jealous of anyone you think has more power and wealth than you, which is an awful lot of people.

    ”I have no problems with female street sex workers. I think they have far more dignity. In fact I think I wouldn't even dare be rude to them.”

    I am sure you wouldn't. That they scare you is no surprise either.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 02:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Yes whatever...

    For me and as people know me actually say Im a person that is very independent, strong minded and very far from being a walk over. And that takes a fair deal of courage and virtue that you will never dare to recognize.

    Im 100% certain you are a bureaucrat Elaine, otherwise I wouldn't say that.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 03:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @250 It sounds like the people that know you are worried about you calling the scum to their face. Being an obnoxious big mouth, CD2, takes no courage whatsoever.

    What you think I do is so far of the truth it is a comfort to me. What you don't know, is a lot. I shall be keeping it that way.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @251
    You think that you are very different to the Argentine bureaucrats that I have confronted since school to adulthood and will probably do so for the rest of my life??…

    You as them identify me as a danger that is why you skip other posters that simply calling on nuking the Middle East, that is why you choose to pick on me, you have insinuated in taking me to court or to scare me not to comment my views in the past, you have tried to alienate me from other posters agreeing with me.

    You are not different to them. That is why I call you for what you are, you are just tyrants, bullies, mincers of words, PR tailor mades and what is worst and will turn to the violence of the State just to uphold your position of power over society. That is why you will defend the police State, that is why you will defend the system even if it is falling down and is failing, as it does you will become more blind and more dangerous.

    With you people to convert to absolute tyrants that walk over and betray freedom, justice and values there is just one step away.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 03:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @244

    You shouldn't expect to post all kinds of poisonous bullshit on here and not have people respond to it. That's not bullying. We're not all here to applaud your genius. Tobi could have told you.

    You have a particular difficulty in bringing critical examination to bear on the texts your posting. You believe everything you read. Your Kissinger text is a good case in point. It's not a document from the US national archives at all, and it's not developed, independent research either. It's a journalist's opinion of what the texts in the actual archives mean.

    If you read the memos carefully, there is another interpretation which is at least as valid and in my view more likely. In diplomacy (and indeed in life generally), you don't get somebody to change their behaviour by telling them they're doing something wrong. You tell them they're doing the right thing, but they could be doing something better.

    I imagine Kissinger was well aware that there was no point in appealing to the better instincts of the sadistic perverts then in power in Argentina, and instead offered up a combination of carrot and stick to try and coax them to some approximation of civilized behaviour. Read between the lines and that;s exactly what he's saying.

    It's hardly surprising that Admiral Guzzetti, as the US Ambassador thought, was so unbelievably incompetent he couldn't figure this out, and heard exactly what he wanted to hear. The entire gang of kleptoperverts had barely a neuron between them as the Falklands war subsequently showed.

    You should learn to assess competing ideas without descending into hysterical abuse when your own are challenged.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 03:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @252 You are absolutely right that the whole world is against you. Every person in authority you have ever met had it in for you personally. Not because you have a bad attitude but because your towering intellect scared the shit out of them. I am alienating you for your own good. They are all out to get you and being isolated is the only safe place for you. Make sure you keep all your guns handy because they are coming for you. etc, etc.

    But seriously, you have been labelled a danger by the Argentines authorities? Are your parents keeping you locked up?

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 04:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    253

    Hamas you haven’t read the declassified Achieve Documents. You are clueless and naive as how to the real world works, you can interpret whatever you wish from it. Ambassador Hill that had all the grandmothers and Human rights NGOs on top of him got what he wanted to hear from Washington, rather than Admiral Guzzetti

    The only reality is that Kissinger and his under Secretary Robinson said to Guzzetti was in the order of “Do it fast, do it quickly and get on with it. We wish you luck.” ”If you can finish before Congress gets back, the better”..

    Kissinger’s job was to fight communism. And he did. Do you really think it was his job to attend to the whims of the Abuelas de Plaza de Mayo that have given birth and raised communist terrorists. Do you think for a moment he gave a fuck about that??

    Because as far as I can remember the foreign policy of the USA is set in Washington, not in the US embassy in Buenos Aires…. Boy if Guzzeti wanted to find out he should have gone and talked to Hill in the embassy and would have spared him is trip to Washington….

    And I can beat you and beat you over and over as I always do. It’s just pointless.

    I rest my case.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @255

    There is nothing more naive than an emotionally incontinent extremist with a confirmation bias. Cf Tobi. You get played like a banjo, and think you're tough.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 04:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    “You've damaged your case enough here, Jack.”
    “Please do not be rude or insulting & maybe people will listen to what you have to say.”

    Well you can go and read again from where you left… Look around if you find any insults or rude comments. Be my guest and please let me know if you find any.
    And what was the point for ??

    You must understand that people will only see and believe what they want to believe. And the obvious social beaten housewife psychology is breathtaking…

    Do you see how the brits gone viral the hashtag #foxnewsfacts ?
    An anti terror expert in the USA dared to get wrong that Birmingham is a
    Muslim majority city, and the populace are at his throat

    So no matter that the Trojan horse had taken place in Birmingham
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10983109/Trojan-horse-plot-report-disturbing-evidence-of-intolerant-Islamic-ethos.html

    So no matter that there are no go areas in Birmingham
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10983109/Trojan-horse-plot-report-disturbing-evidence-of-intolerant-Islamic-ethos.html

    So no matter there is Sharia law in Birmingham
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/education/educationnews/10983109/Trojan-horse-plot-report-disturbing-evidence-of-intolerant-Islamic-ethos.html
    And probably nobody knows the % of Muslims under 35s

    What matters is an overreacted, hysterical and insecure gang up on the guy just to feel a little better of themselves…

    That is why you should have no fuzzy lines, and not curb into the bullies and the populists, the liars and the deniars.

    Jan 12th, 2015 - 09:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    257 CabezaDura2

    The hashtag #foxnewsfacts is satire. You know, humour, funny. Your head is so far up your arse you can't even see it.

    What the guy said was utterly ludicrous and he deserves to be ridiculed. Calling people 'at his throat' is just a tad hysterical.

    What I don't really understand is why all this bothers you so much. Do you live in Birmingham?

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 12:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Are you a counter terrorist expert that knows any better than the american guy??? Or the British twitter cunts counter terror experts??

    Birmingham is a shithole and neither do you live there…. And guess what you moron…. It’s not the fucking point!!!

    The point is overreacted, hysterical political correctness and insecure Brits gang up on the guy just to feel a little better of themselves… And that there is all to it. A lot of REAL BRITS are saying that he is not so far from the truth.
    I know a LOT of social psychology I come from one of the most populist country in the world---- and you have far more in common with them common argies – oh not with me you don’t- than you realize.

    And of course I care about the Islamiphication of Europe!! It is a very scary and real prospect.

    PS. Im still waiting for you to own up to your accusations and post the comment that what was so racist

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 01:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    259 CabezaDura2

    You're not all there, are you, you poor thing.
    You don't have to be a counter-terrorism expert to know the guy was talking bollox; you just have to either have been there, or to look at the statistics.
    I went to school in the West Midlands and probably know a bit more about it than you do, so you can just stop your frothy-mouthed ranting at me, and your vile language as well.
    A lot of the people doing the mocking on twitter were actually from Birmingham, and they probably know more than you do too. It isn't a shit hole; well, maybe New Street Station is quite bad. Furthermore, there being a Muslim population doesn't make it any more or less of a shithole. That is the part of your argument that is racist (and don't give me any of that 'Islam is not a race' crap; you aren't talking about the white British Muslims).
    A lot of 'real Brits' are probably agreeing with you; that is their right. They are being fed the same crap from the right wing media that you are and they are lapping it up for the same reasons that you are. You be scared if you want to; just don't imagine that you have a handle on the truth when you got it from Rupert Murdoch.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 10:40 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @260 Should we tell CD2 (Danger Mouse) that the counter-terrorism 'expert' that made that ridiculous statement has apologised for making the completely inaccurate statement about Birmingham? I doubt he will be called on as an 'expert' again.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    The American guy has since apologised to being wrong.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 11:32 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    260.

    What has race got to do with Birmingham being a shithole?? Why should I talk about “white” British Muslims, I talk about Islam, Islam is an ideology?? ... YOU ADDED THE WHITE PART. You dont make any sense otherwise.

    You lefties just call racist allmost anybody when you have lost the debate.

    All those twitter idiots did was simply attack the messenger. I have seing it play over and over in Argentina when people are being called on uncomfortable truths. I've seing it work over and over and over.
    The story is not that the expert got it wrong, the story is the viral hashtag.

    Have all those 3 articles got to do with Rupert Murdoch ??? I dont think so

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 02:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    The people on twitter were ridiculing the self-styled security expert for being entirely wrong about Birmingham. Even he has admitted he was wrong and apologised. Only you are still defending his statement. You are a fool.

    The tweets were witty and amusing in the main. Great to see use humour against a blatant liar intent of whipping up Islamophobia.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    The only part he got wrong is that Birmingham is a city 100% Muslim... Trojan Horse, sharia courts, crminality and so much more that we shall refuse to talk about..

    You are just attacking the messenger. That is all there is too it.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 02:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @265 None of that exists in the U.K. so don't worry about it.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 03:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    265 CabezaDura2

    That's never 'all there is to it' How incredibly arrogant. You apply a glib phrase without engaging your brain and then decide to close down any further discussion.

    No-one said any of those things could not be discussed. They just pointed out that Birmingham was in fact 80% non-Muslim. You are the one closing down any discussion by making sweeping statements and refusing to to justify them. In fact, you should get a job on Fox News, since your idea of a 'fact' seems quite similar to theirs.

    I haven't lost any debate, because there hasn't been one. All I've heard so far is your shouting, but I don't think you've actually made a point yet,

    Oh and Islam is a religion, not an ideology.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 04:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @261
    Danger Mouse. LOL!

    @267
    You can always tell when he's lost, because that's when he starts yelling he's won.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 04:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    267. There is no point in even discussing with idiots that have their heads so up their arses, looking for fairy tells in their ascending colons.

    You havent debated absolutely anything all you have done is accused me of being a racist and not own up to your claims, in fact you are a racist when you come along making the distiction of “white” Muslims. I have always said that Islam is the problem, never ever made the distinction whether they are from Pakistani, white Britsh, Turkish, Arab, Chechen or any other ETHNIC origin. YOU DID and that makes you the racist!

    That is debating and holding an argument, something that none of you are incapable of.

    Ohhh and your census in 2011 is Millions away from the actual % that you have at school. You have 10,3 Muslim's at school in Birmingham probably 30% or more... Where they tried to infiltrate and put jihadists brainwashing pupils.

    Of course dont look at the bigger picture, take all out of PERSPECTIVE, and push your head a little bit deeper inside....

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 04:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    Here is an attempt to calculate numbers of jihadi terrorists in the world.

    The US State Department is required to present to Congress a set of country reports, with estimates on the numbers of terrorist organisations active in the world, and their membership. While the figures are for the most part rather vague (“several thousand”), etc, this is a reflection of the fact that nobody knows really. There are however grounds for supposing that the State Department figures are more accurate than most, since they are accountable to Congress for what they produce, they have to justify the allocation of resources on some kind of rational basis, and they have the resources of the US government behind.

    This makes them quite distinct from those who are pulling figures out of their buttocks for a mixture of psychological, ideological, and venal reasons.

    The report lists 28 terror organisations that may be considered Islamic. Many of these groups are factions and offshoots of each other, which suggests that this is not a unified movement with a single objective, and is typical of the behaviour of all loony and fringe groups, which all hate each other guts and fragment continuously.

    To put some numbers on the State Department analysis, I have done the following :
    - where they give a number, I use the number
    - where they give a range, I take the upper figure
    - where they say several thousand, I put 10,000
    - where they say several hundred, I put 1000
    - where they say low or a few hundred, I put 500
    - where they say unknown, I put the average of all of the above.

    The number that comes out at the end is 150,000.

    This is almost certainly a gross exaggeration. It does not mean either that all the 150,000 have a primary objective the imposition of a Muslim Caliphate on the Muslim West. Most of these groups have their origin in regional conflicts, and have objectives related to these conflicts.

    http://www.state.gov/j/ct/rls/crt/2013/224829.htm

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 05:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    269 CabezaDura2

    You still haven't made a point.
    I never did argue with the figures; I crunched some numbers from the census and other sources when I was putting off doing something more useful, and 10% of children in schools is probably about right. The % will be higher in some areas.
    That isn't a point, it's a fact. I'm waiting for you to make a point.
    All I'm getting so far is hysterical nonsense about jihadists brainwashing pupils. It's pathetic. Educate yourself about the Trojan Horse affair, or stop quoting it. It was about the governance of an academy chain. Not about jihadists brainwashing every kid in Birmingham. You really should be on Fox News.

    You're unbelievably arrogant , you think that all this crap you get get off the internet is more reliable than the experience of people who have lived in the UK and taught in inner city schools. You sound more like a crazy conspiracy theorist than anything else. I still haven't fully grasped why you're getting so aerated about this. How can it possibly affect you?

    I think you are a racist, because you are beside yourself with rage at the thought of there being Muslim children in the schools of a country that is nothing to do with you, and you can't explain why. The only explanation is that you are in some way revolted by these children because they are Muslim. I'll call you religious bigot instead if you think that's better.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 05:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @270 I just watched a news report on the BBC that indicated that there are just over 5,000 individuals posing a threat to Europe. These 5,000+ are by no means a group working together but rather fragmented as you described. It is 5,000 more than we would like but by no means the numbers that excite the religious war-mongers.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 05:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @272

    That's about the same as those liberal pinko PC wimp softies at MI5 have also been saying.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 05:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @271
    First of all Sir, the only racist is yourself, and I have just proven it. But don’t worry I’m not a lefty bamby like yourself and I don’t win arguments by basically ending my argument “You are a racist” I’m not a dishonest integrity less bigot. That I leave to you.

    The fact is there was an attempt to infiltrate BIRMINGHAM state schools, by Islamists to brainwash pupils with Jihad… Now this didn’t happen in other places of the UK where % of Muslim pupils are much less say Scotland it happened in Birmingham. FACT.

    That there is many no go areas for non Muslims in the city is a FACT.
    You have bills proposing that teachers spy on toddlers to see if they have jihadist tendencies FACT.

    So clearly what is happening at your schools is not a minor issue.

    And I have already told you, the problem is Islam. In the next decades they will be 20%, 30% and have their own parties. They will inherit Europe's technology, weapons, economy, governments. Yes I totally admit that I have a problem with that. Not a problem with their race

    Opinions come and go, and they have interests in them. I don’t think nor even close to consider you a reliable source, on the other hand I know and here many other French, Brits, Dutch Germans say otherwise and the facts and numbers seem to overall coincide with what they are saying far more than the Statist liberal lefties. And you DON’T LIVE in Birmingham either!!! So yes I stick to the facts I’m a logical person. You can bitch around all you like but you can’t turn aside that this is a widespread concern at least, not the inventions of Fox News or the bigoted opinions of a random Argie in internet…. Or you can and push yourself further and further inside yourself.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 05:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    CD2 (Danger Mouse) says:

    “The whole of Europe should be nuked by Israel & USA sooner rather than later...WGF. Stupid spics like Marcos Alejandro, Vestige, the retarded Brits here, the Frenchies, Italicunts, Belgiums, Russians, Sweeds everyone, allong with the Muslims that are feeding off them, all need to be wiped out.”

    But he thinks he isn't racist or a bigot.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 06:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I think you are becoming a pretty pathetic lately. Miss Snitch cant but help herself throwing handbags and spreading gossip everywhere... Interfering “ ”ohh you know“… He said this, he said that”, asking to Popps Im a liar about my guns and highly dangerous person.. Ohh my LOL!!

    VIEJA ALCAHUETE... LLEVA Y TRAE

    I was just paying back Vestige and Marquitos Alejandro for being antisemitic bastards being derogative to the antiterrorist expert from Israel and being provocative.... Why didn't you call on them ???

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @276 LOL! Caught out by your own words and you don't like it.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 06:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Not at all, I dont mind it and I have no problems owning my statements. I find it really pathetic and funny you going around from thread to thread picking stuff up and taking it elsewhre and being a gossiper.

    “He said ”X“, he is such a racist!!” ......

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 06:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @275

    I'm just wondering what Meltdown King Tobi the Sage of Mendoza is going to do to get his crown back. Pretty soon he's going to be just another guy around here.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 06:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @279 Or he is still here……

    @276 I don't think you are a highly dangerous person at all. You claimed that people in authority in Argentina have labelled you as a danger since school age and into adulthood. (Your post @ 252) I suspect they meant you are a danger to yourself.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 07:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    280
    Ohh yes, interesting that you assume that everyone that doesn't fit into the system is nutts and a danger to himself or bitter . Everyone that doesn’t agree with you comes under the psycho analyst Elaine judgment mode.

    You know nothing about me, will you not just leave me alone and let me comment in peace?? Grow up woman!

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 07:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @281 You said you were labelled a danger from school through to adulthood; your words. I said I don't think you are dangerous at all, far from it.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 07:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    No I didn't say that. I said the identify me as a danger.., and im not going into futher detail.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    I can't imagine why anybody would think that a chap with guns, an excitable disposition, and 800 million imaginary enemies would be a danger to anybody.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 08:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @284 He also claims he is not a misogynist. To be fair he is getting lessons from a master of it here:

    http://en.mercopress.com/2015/01/09/charlie-hebdo-plans-to-publish-a-million-copies-on-next-week-s-edition#comment375044

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 08:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @285
    They do make a lovely couple.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 09:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    274 CabezaDura2

    You don't know where I live.
    You don't know anything about me at all.

    I'm not the least bit surprised you have friends in Germany and Holland who think we are all going to be under Sharia law in a few years. One thing Europe's not short of is right wing nut jobs who want to blame there troubles on someone else when the going gets tough. It doesn't usually turn out so well though does it.

    And if there were 10% Muslims in the UK. No, make it 20%. And 10% of them are keen on some kind of Islamist regime. How exactly are they going to sweep all before them in a general election? Even if every single Muslim voted for a Muslim party MP, they'd still only get 50 MPs. And do you know why that is, O logical one? It's because they all live in f*^$*&^ Birmingham and Bradford ffs. They aren't going to make much of a dent in the Tory heartlands are they.

    I've met some arrogant pricks on this forum, but you just about take the biscuit. Make that arrogant misogynist pricks.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 09:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    CD sadly is showing his age and hoping,

    Europe will not be over run with anyone,
    neither will their be a holy war,

    but there will be a lot of disappointment when CFK leaves office without stealing the Falkland's,
    that is a fact,

    and the only fact one should be interested in,

    Europe will remain the same as its always been, self interested,
    and the sooner we get out the better.

    Jan 13th, 2015 - 11:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @287

    I don’t know and don’t care where you live, all I know is you don’t live in Birmingham....Which is the point.

    Certainly my mates in Germany & Netherlands had their feet on the ground unlike some libtards in that live in a politically correct bubble. Being bullied by gangs of Moroccans in Amsterdam is not a nice way to grow up.

    You produced a fine story of Muslims static in Birmingham as if they had their feet pasted to the city and will not continue to immigrate and populate the country as you die out (1.6 birth rates) and perhaps the average white UK population is in their mid 30s or more. A lot of females are going through menopause (caugh caugh) and will leave no decedents at all. The same is happening in Europe. While Muslims are at 4.0

    Usually the way to measure the amount of an X population over time say a year is the total + [immigrants+ births] - [migrants+ deaths]
    However over a decade ago London for example was white majority. Now it’s not. Over 600.000 left and died out. Over 200 K relocated in the UK another 400. K migrated to ANZAC countries, Spain or wherever else. There is a way in which the native population behaves when it decreases 60% and simply vanishes exponentially. That needs to be mathematically accounted too, but it is a social behavior that you will see it multiply in your lifetime everywhere.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 12:08 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    289 CabezaDura2

    'White majority'? I thought you said we weren't talking about race. Sorry, but you've completely lost me after 'native population'.
    My friend is a doctor whose grandparents came here from India; she's now doing her PhD in gastroenterology because she wants to help find a cure for bowel cancer. Is she the problem you're talking about? One of these 'non whites' insidiously populating the country? Another university friend is a patent lawyer in London; his parents came from Sri Lanka; he'll be part of your 'non white London' majority I suppose.
    The difference between me and you is that you think the colour of these people's skin is important, and I don't. Simple as that.
    Your barking up the wrong tree anyway; the highest birth rates are amongst the Eastern European communities, and in another generation you won't be able to tell them from the 'native population'. I'm guessing that won't bother you, as they are 'white'.
    You're a horror. Makes me shudder to think of the consequences for the Falklands if you ever got your hands on it. You know we're not all white there either, don't you?
    As for 'A lot of females are going through menopause (caugh caugh)' WTF is that supposed to mean? They always have, you know. Are you blaming this on the fact that women can't keep popping out babies until they're 60?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 09:15 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @290 I think you can take huge comfort from the fact that CD2 is so monumentally imbecilic that he will never be in a position to accomplish anything likely to harm anyone but himself.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 10:07 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    291 ElaineB

    I know. I shouldn't argue with idiots. I'm only doing it because I'm stuck at my computer for many hours a day and it's a welcome distraction. By next week I'll be over it :-)

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 10:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @292 Me too, prepping for my next trip.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 10:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    290.

    Are you going to adress anything or simply fish any comments in my post for you to call the “racist card”?? In fact I already called you on this and that is all you are programmed to do, you dont debete nor discuss anything. Because all you lefties in collage are fucking race baiters. Nothing else.

    In what category “native white British should I otherwise comment to have have 1.6 birth rates?? Because they actually do. FACT. Are the statistics office racist too???
    How I'm I supposed to define the other categories?? And a lot of whites are actually atheists. I cant use Christian vs Muslim. If saying this makes me a racist so are you.

    Sikh and Hinudu overall coincide overtime with white birth rates after a generation or too.
    Eastern Europeans have higher birth rates but are not anywhere near the Muslims 3.0 rates. In fact Muslim names are the most used in the UK for babies.

    Eastern Europe itself is going through winter demografics. And immigrant populations tend to have the birth rates of their country of origin.

    ”A lot of females are going through menopause (cough cough) WTF does that mean?”

    It means to say you have a large % of old folk that are going to die out in the next 20 years leaving no decendency. The Muslims are still young and having lots of babies. when that happens you are going to become 40% or 50% Muslim over night.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 12:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    294 CabezaDura2

    Wow..I can't tell whether you think the answer is to kick out all the Muslims or to encourage white women to have more children.

    No, you hysterical fool. We are not going to become 50% Muslim 'overnight'.
    Furthermore, today's menopausal women are going to be tomorrow's pensioners. They won't all be dead; they'll be relying on the next generation to support them in their old age. It's probably a good thing that there will be a new generation then; I couldn't give a stuff what their religion is. Or anyone else's for that matter. Religion is a private matter.
    The 'religious names' thing is a complete red herring; if Christians all named their kids 'Jesus' it would be right up there in the list. They don't; it's a cultural thing.

    I'm done with this. There is nothing to debate; you think it's important and I don't.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 12:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    295.
    And what is your solution ? Do nothing, look the other way because according to you there is no problem I get it.

    So why did you came along and be bitchy and shitty to me in the first place?? What a lefty prick. FFS

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    296 CabezaDura2
    The solution is for us all to learn to live together,and the problem is that that is not always easy. However, it isn't solved by the kind of febrile hand-wringing that you seem to want to indulge in.

    It's nothing personal. The day I start making ill-informed pronouncements about the future of Argentina I'll expect the same treatment from you.

    If we're talking 'solutions', I haven't heard one from you yet either.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    But you are not from the UK are you??
    You are foreign and in collage with it seems very little grasp of the situation.

    “The solution is for us all to learn to live together, and the problem is that that is not always easy” Ahhh do nothing; look the other way because according to you there is no problem... What they have being doing for the last....Hmmmm 20 years or more ”

    “The day I start making ill-informed pronouncements about the future of Argentina I'll expect the same treatment from you.”

    I have stated nothing but the facts. And Im obviously far more researched than you are. In fact I have sided on most occasions with foreigners here when Argies in denial were lying their teeth out of the situation here regarding socio- economics. That is because I’m honest and obsessive with detail and the truth. I side with the truth and reason, not with peoples passports. Think about that
    You are not like that. So I really feel I should exchange any opinions with you any longer. You are just a collage lefty fart.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:18 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @298 “But you are not from the UK are you??
    You are foreign and ………. with it seems very little grasp of the situation. ”

    Right back at you.

    You can't really, as a foreigner, use that argument with a straight face.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    299.
    Well he said my German and Dutch mates, are right wing nutters. But they grew up unlike him on their streets they lived there. They didn't grew up on a little politically correct collage campus!!!

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @300 But YOU don't.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:27 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    301. But I do state fact and talk logic. Unlike him.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @302 I DO live in the U.K. and can tell you that you have no idea, do not speak facts and do not understand logic.

    I am sure your 'friends' in Germany and The Netherlands just love winding you up. You swallow everything they tell you.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    You have lived for how many years in Palermo ?? Going to restaurants and watching Polo?? And yet you know nor understand nothing of Argentina. You just pick up opinions to get an idea on anything. Which is part of your Government job. You living or travelling anywhere is so overrated.

    I know their backgrounds as the English lawyer that had gone abroad. The guy knew his streets, you dont. You travel half of the year going around kissing rich peoples behinds.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Question ?
    if the UK leaves the EU,
    would one suggest that the Muslim population would increase, ,,,or decrease.
    in the UK.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @304 By your own argument, you know nothing about the U.K. because you are a foreigner.

    Why don't you think before you post?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    No, my argument is Monty is a collage lefty, you are a bureaucrat. So your opinions just because you live there are dubious.

    The facts and the numbers tell a different story.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @307 Except neither of those assumptions are FACT.

    You THINK Monty is in college.

    You THINK I am a bureaucrat.

    Just because you THINK it, doesn't make it FACT.

    See how you set yourself up to be knocked down every time?

    @305 What do you think?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 01:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    mmmm Interesting thought,

    I think perhaps it would decrease slightly and settle down,
    the reasoning would be a return to controlling our borders again,

    then again depending on the middle east refuge problem we could see a rise,

    but I do think Europe will see an increase ,.
    just my opinion.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @305
    “if the UK leaves the EU,
    would one suggest that the Muslim population would increase, ,,,or decrease.”

    It will increase. As your native population has even lower birth rates than the Eastern Europeans that immigrate to the UK, so if they are placed with restrictions to come in the relative % of Muslims in the country will increase.
    Non EU immigration to the UK was always higher than EU migration. It doesn’t mean to say you should not leave the EU


    308.

    No, stupid, the birth rates, the trojan horse, the bill to spy on toddlers in nurseries, the demographic factors, etc. Those are all facts.

    You are a bureaucrat and Monty stated he is at collage, I guess anybody can say anything. But its not the point.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    One would like to think that if the Muslims in the Middle East could be brought to peace, and learn to live together,

    Then a rebuilding program was started, improvements in education, health, housing,
    Travel, and they slowly but surely came up to western standards, [ if that’s the right way ]
    Then perhaps many would return home,
    If they could be guaranteed a better standard of living,

    After all, the west is not all good for them, with all our bad habits, smoking, drinking, drugs, crime, dishonesties, etc,
    Perhaps they would feel happier, who knows,

    Just a thought.

    back later....

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @310 “You are a bureaucrat and Monty stated he is at collage, I guess anybody can say anything. But its not the point.”

    It is the point. This is not FACT. It is what you THINK. You really don't understand the basics.

    @309

    Certainly there would be more control at the borders but we take refugees and immigrants from outside of Europe so wouldn't that base increase?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Stop running around in circles

    The birth rates, the trojan horse, the bill to spy on toddlers in nurseries, the demographic factors, etc. Those are all facts that matter to this discussion, and you have not once challenged them.

    I just know you are a bureaucrat. You can deny it till you become blue in the face. I just know you are.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @313 Your original argument was stated here:

    “But you are not from the UK are you??
    You are foreign and in collage with it seems very little grasp of the situation. ”

    So by your own 'logic' you cannot possibly know anything about anything in the U.K. because you are a foreigner. YOUR OWN 'LOGIC'.

    Having lost that point you changed your argument to this:

    “No, my argument is Monty is a collage lefty, you are a bureaucrat. So your opinions just because you live there are dubious. ”

    This is supposition and not FACT.

    Just because you THINK you know something does not make it true.

    I have neither confirmed nor denied my profession on this message board. What you THINK you know is not FACT. You should really take that on board as it could revolutionise your life.

    Has your amazing superior intellect worked out the meaning of that that cartoon yet, or are you still waiting to be told what to think?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    Elaine, this is what happens when you mingle with other people’s conversations being a manipulative old freak you are

    Its not “YOUR OWN 'LOGIC'.” Its Montty’s

    It was certainly Monty69 that brought this up when he said and rightly so that I don’t live in the UK hence I’m not entitled to an opinion for I would not understand the situation in the ground. In it there is an assumption that because he lives in the UK, she does know what is going on. He also dared to describe Germans and Dutch that have grown in their own streets as right wing nutters.

    Well no facts and numbers prove her wrong, and he doesn’t know that much what is going on in the streets he is in collage campus!!
    FFS stop playing around in circles and being so retarded and illogical. You are just so tiresome.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:41 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @315 You are the one declaring that you use LOGIC and FACT. I just proved that you use neither. What you state is only what you THINK. You just undermined your own credibility.

    Must try harder.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    He/she is a collage lefty you are a bureaucrat. I just have no proof of it.

    But I have sources and proof about the real issue and the problem in question. You are just trolling me

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 02:57 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @314

    “What you THINK you know is not FACT. You should really take that on board as it could revolutionise your life.”

    You've nailed him there. He thinks a FACT is something he's read.

    @315
    Of course there are right wing nutters in Germany and Holland. There are right wing nutters everywhere. There is a certain irreducible proportion of nutters everywhere you go. Some of them are right wing, some of them are left wing, some of them are EekAMuslim!s, some of them are Christians, some of them are nationalists. They are all the same, in that they need hatred to make sense of the world, and violence to interact with it.

    Civilized societies are civilized not because they don't have any nutters, but because they have worked out ways to keep them in check without becoming nutters themselves. It's quite a neat trick if you can pull it off, but of course there are always nutters of one stamp or another trying to undermine it. Typically, it's people who believe everything they read, but only read what confirms their belief.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 03:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @317 “He/she is a collage lefty you are a bureaucrat. I just have no proof of it.”

    So you admit it is not a FACT, just what you THINK. With your credibility in shreds it will be hard to believe anything you say is FACT.

    And you can't even use anything your new best friend says to back you up as he doesn't live in the U.K. anymore. The one person that agreed with you and you have completely discredited him by your own 'LOGIC'.

    So, given that you don't use LOGIC or FACT it is hard to believe anything you say.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 03:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    It’s a fact that you are a bureaucrat. I just have no proof of it.

    This is how your sock puppets like Hamas think you are….Elaine
    http://images.psxextreme.com/wallpapers/ps3/blue_bikini_on_the_beach_1109.jpg

    This is more like you truly are-
    http://images.psxextreme.com/wallpapers/ps3/blue_bikini_on_the_beach_1109.jpg

    This is how you want me to look like
    http://images.psxextreme.com/wallpapers/ps3/blue_bikini_on_the_beach_1109.jpg

    This is how I am

    http://images.psxextreme.com/wallpapers/ps3/blue_bikini_on_the_beach_1109.jpg

    just a joka

    ; )

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 03:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @321 CD2 says: “It’s a fact that you are a bureaucrat. I just have no proof of it.” That is what one would call ILLOGIC.

    You have no proof so it is not a FACT. It is a figment of your rampant imagination, just like your other claims. Why do you further undermine your own credibility?

    I imagine you have been desperately trying to find something oh, so witty, to link here but I never click links so I will have to miss out. I am sure it is as hilarious as you are intelligent.

    Have you worked out that cartoon yet? Kinda slow, aren't you.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 04:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    I knew you would say something like that being that you are very bitter, serious, old, and politically correct bureaucrat… Otherwise very dull and boring.

    “I am sure it is as hilarious as you are intelligent.” We finally agree in something.

    PS. Can't we just disengage from now on??

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @322 Can't win an argument so you post abuse. Showing yourself up again.

    As long as you post here and I want to respond, I will. As long as you post nonsense, I will pull you up on it. As long as you make offensive, racist, misogynist, xenophobic remarks, I will show you up for what you are.

    Do you understand that cartoon now? You have had hours to work out the glaringly obvious meaning or is it too hard for you?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 04:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    Wow and this show keeps on going like an Energizer Bunny. This is a match of endurance here. One can only wonder who will tire first.

    lol

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 05:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    @324

    Ohhh no, she has mortally wounded me….. I admit it!! My evil plans of genocide of those peaceful innocent Muslims and Nazi-Zionist-patriarchical- world domination would have worked had it not being because of Girl Scout ElaineB & super friends of the Liberal league.

    She is a relentless adversary she has won my formal endorsement for honorary president of Guardian readers appreciation society.
    I caaaaanntt type any loooonger… erhgg uf *
    [Dies]

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 05:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    322 CabezaDura2

    You can't infer anything from my posts about my age, my gender, my profession, the amount of time I've spent in the UK, or what I was doing here. All you have is your own assumptions, and those say a lot more about you than about me.

    There are plenty of nutters in the world, and most of them grew up on their own streets. I define you and your pals as nutters because I think you are right out there on the edge of the normality spectrum. Most people would find the idea that 'native British' people are going to die out overnight to be replaced by radical Islamists frankly laughable. As if Muslims are going to vote to replace the liberal democracy in which they have built their lives for generations with anything else.

    I'll challenge you over one thing if you like; the bill to spy on toddlers. Who proposed it, when was it debated in parliament and when did it become law? Because if it didn't, it's just another crackpot idea in the run up to an election as a sop to people like you.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 05:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @310

    If there's anything more cary than the EekAMuslim! population, it's the EekAMuslim! population having carnival knowledge.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    326.
    You are not street savvy, you are just a collage lefty... BTW your assumptions on my mates opinions are as just as open.

    “As if Muslims are going to vote to replace the liberal democracy in which they have built their lives for generations with anything else.”

    That is why not a single Middle Eastern country is a shining example of liberal democracy... That is exactly why the Arab Spring that the West choose to interpret as a democratic revolution turned out to be another Sunni Islamic revolution. Then no surprise… You ended up with the Muslim Brotherhood in control in Egypt.
    As if Islam is simply compatible with democracy and western values...What a joke!!

    I never said the bill passed I said you are becoming a police Orwellian State, the mere idea that your lawmakers are thinking about it is telling, Ohh and just yesterday Cameron talked about of openly spying on Whatssapp messages.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @328

    Was it EekAMuslim! belief that denied liberal democracy to Latin America and most of Asia for so long, or was there some other factor involved?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    #325 Did you have to see the video of the proud Muslim father watching his 9 year old put multiple bullets through the heads to two Russian field operatives? I did.....not totally convinced it was real as the cranium is under a lot of pressure and those tow remained perfectly intact. However...the point is.....some Dad's teach there son's to fish and other's....well........

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @330
    There certainly are some sick bastards around.

    The daughter of a Belgian priest has confessed to helping him kill four close relatives, including her two brothers, dismember the bodies, and dump them in plastic bags outside a slaughterhouse, a Belgian newspaper said yesterday.

    http://www.heraldscotland.com/sport/spl/aberdeen/priest-s-daughter-party-to-killings-family-murdered-then-cut-up-or-dumped-in-acid-1.368271

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    328 CabezaDura2

    You don't know what I am. Using the term 'street savvy' makes you sound like you're about 12

    So the bill didn't pass then. Was it even voted on? Hmm... so your argument is based on what people are thinking about? You haven't really grasped the whole party politics thing have you? Or the political affiliations of the newspapers.
    This Election is going to be about the far right trying to whip up fear and hatred of minorities, the left trying to focus on issues like health and welfare, and the Tories trying to simultaneously talk about the economy and work out how much anti immigration stuff they need to dish out to stop them leaching votes to UKIP.

    Meanwhile people like you will sit on the sidelines not really understanding what's going on, but finding plenty in there to reinforce your extreme views.

    I'm still waiting for you to come up with a solution to whatever problem it is that you think we have. If democracy is so incompatible with Islamic values then I expect all the Muslims will be packing their bags pretty soon to head to Syria, and then the 'problem' will solve itself.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Captain Poppy

    Now Hans.......I thought you were going to ignore me rather than mitigate the actions of a fanatical terrorist with a comparative sick act of a non muslim?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 06:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @333

    Who's mitigating anything?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    332.
    I remember now, you are a Falklander is that it??? You grew up in the arse end of nowhere in a little town of 2000 inhabitants and are paid a uni scholarship by the FIG, and you are going to know much better than a kid who grew up in a mix class hood of Amsterdam.......Riiiight.

    Again I never said the bill past. So?

    “I'm still waiting for you to come up with a solution to whatever problem it is that you think we have”

    Great, that is exactly to the point.. and you have answered yourself already
    You don’t recognize you have a problem! How are you going to fix a problem if you are in denial about it??

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    335 CabezaDura2

    No. Utterly wrong on almost all counts.

    What was your solution again? I am in denial that there is a problem, so I'm counting on you. Although if you remember, I did say that according to your logic all the Muslims would probably head off soon all by themselves.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    You go to the doctor, you have a lump that is growing and growing, you ask solutions to the Doctor.
    The Doctor will say to you, you need to have a multiple analysis and see what you have.
    Now you are in these stages already

    You as a patient begin to call the Doctor a racist..You don’t want do the analysis and when the results eventually come up, you deny them.

    The doctor says look you need to get real all evidence shows that you have cancer, if you don’t do a systemic surgery followed by chemotherapy it will eventually consume you and you die.

    Then you reply ohh no Doctor, you are a racist!! Poor tumor cells, I only have a very tiny minority of cells in my body, not all of the tumor cells are like that, I just need a small laser surgery to remove the radical cells from propagating. There is no such thing as cancer. It just doesn’t. It just doesn't,

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @337

    What if you go the doctor saying you've got the Alien chest burster, and he says there's no such thing?

    Does that mean the doctor's in denial and you should find another doctor?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    337 CabezaDura2

    Sorry, but are you saying we should kill all the Muslims?

    We're definitely through this time. You are not just an oddball; you're a criminal.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    366.
    I tell you what... If you admit openly that Islam itself is the problem, you will get what my thought out solution would be.

    First off all you have to admit the results of the tests and be willing to hear the diagnosis

    But until you do so its no point.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:46 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • toooldtodieyoung

    337 CabezaDura2

    Still on about the Eekamuslims!!! are you CD2?

    Btw am glad you mentioned Sharia Law CD2 because I really need your help and support; my faith is being severely tested.

    Let me tell you about the things I've had to put up with this week:

    On Monday my wife went out to work. WORK! I said “but your role is to be in the home”. She left (driving would you believe) saying something about being “quite worried about my behaviour”.

    Anyway, I thought at least my daughter will wear her Hijab to school today, although she claimed she didn't have one and didn't like it one bit when I tried to improvise with a woolly scarf.

    So Tuesday we had a client meeting in London, and when I interrupted proceedings to heed the call to prayer, the client looked at me in anguish. The client obviously didn't have his prayer mat with him and so left hurriedly! I can tell my boss wasn't happy with him either, as he was in a mood all afternoon.

    Wednesday I went to my local coffee house, the George and Dragon, and asked for my usual thick sweet coffee. Get this, the man next to me was offered and purchased alcohol. ALCOHOL! The outrage I felt was unquantifiable. You wait till the religious police hear of this I said. On my way from work on Thursday I found the same heinous scandal taking place in the Bakers Arms and the Cricketers. I was delirious by the time I got home.

    But the worst was yet to come. On Saturday we went away to the Lake District for the weekend. My wife said the fresh air might do me good. We walked into a sandwich shop and there... BOLD. AS. BRASS. were half a dozen HAM sandwiches, yes HAM (you heard me right!) all out in the open, no hint of shame or even pretence of adherance to the strict Sharia law we live under in Britain. It was just out. rage. ous. Brazen. Barefaced indecency.

    So help me CD2, you're the only person that seems to see Britain the way I do.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @340

    What if you go to the doctor and say “doctor, doctor I've got this horrible nasty lump full of bile and pus”, and the doctor says “I can see that, it's your head”?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 07:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    340 CabezaDura2

    No. I'm not an anti-religious bigot. Islam is not the problem, neither is Christianity or Judaism.
    People like you are the problem. Some of them are Muslims, many are not. You're all intolerant extremists and different sides of the same coin. Fortunately, there aren't all that many of you.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 08:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    343.
    Q. “I tell you what... If you admit openly that Islam itself is the problem, you will get what my thought out solution would be.”

    R. “No. I'm not an anti-religious bigot. Islam is not the problem, neither is Christianity or Judaism.”

    Well that is all there is to it. You go ahead just push a little futher inside. yourself...

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 08:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @344

    What if you go to the doctor, and say “Doctor, Doctor, I've got this horrible nasty lump”, and the the Doctor says : “

    Paranoid personality disorder

    - Pervasive distrust and suspicion of others and their motives
    - Unjustified belief that others are trying to harm or deceive you
    - Unjustified suspicion of the loyalty or trustworthiness of others
    - Hesitant to confide in others due to unreasonable fear that others will use the information against you
    - Perception of innocent remarks or nonthreatening situations as personal insults or attacks
    - Angry or hostile reaction to perceived slights or insults
    - Tendency to hold grudges
    - Unjustified, recurrent suspicion that spouse or sexual partner is unfaithful

    http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/personality-disorders/basics/symptoms/con-20030111”

    Does this mean that the doctor is out to get you?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 08:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    If any of you have access to Channel 4 tonight at 10:00, you can see some of CD2's mates. Sickening.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 08:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Monty69

    344 CabezaDura2

    Why is your telling me the solution conditional on me? How very convenient for you. Not very magnanimous of you though is it? Aren't you going to feel guilty when we all go to hell in a handcart, and you had the means to save us all along?

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 08:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @345 @347 You finally stumped him. I doff my cap to you both.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 09:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    348.
    Toby might get a little jealous when he returns and finds out that you are obssesed with someone else...

    Just saying.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 09:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • lsolde

    @349 CabezaDura2,
    Stop arguing, Cabeza.
    You can't win & you're clutching at straws.
    And getting too personal & insulting.
    However, l agree with one statement that you made,
    lslam is the problem.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 10:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    350.
    Well a clue is in my nick name. Hard head..
    “And getting too personal & insulting.”.... Or is that only me ??

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 10:09 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    One does not think you guys are going to agree on anything,

    interesting thought , we argue/debate/disagree,
    whilst the Muslims watch us.arguing over them..
    just saying like.

    Jan 14th, 2015 - 11:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ChrisR

    @ 351 CabezaDura2

    I agree with Isolde.

    “Or is that only me ??”

    What does that matter? You are not really worried about that, surely?

    Do yourself a favour and let it be.

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 10:16 am - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Stevie

    Interesting thread...

    Cabeza, seems your tactics aren't being backed by the old continent anymore... Must be the instant coffee solution that is called news... You know, it was just easier to drive around in your Falcons after 'you' named 'us' terrorists and had the world watching the other way.

    Never again Cabeza. Nunca mas!

    And for our British posters, you really need to make difference between people and people in SA, we aren't homogenous in our values and ideologies.
    I understand the generalisations are intended to hit target, but it's like killing butterflies with a shotgun...

    That said, it would seem I'm just as guilty in my combing...

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 05:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • HansNiesund

    @346

    Did you see it? The children of immigrants getting themselves all worked up into a violent lather about .... immigrants.

    But one thing was striking - the guy who was giving it all up because he'd realised all his hatred was really directed at himself.

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 07:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • Briton

    Fears in Europe of violent retaliation

    Belgian police have killed two men who were suspected of planning to launch “large-scale” terrorist attacks imminently in the country.
    They died during one of about 10 raids carried out against alleged Islamist extremists thought to have returned from fighting in the Syrian civil war
    http://news.sky.com/story/1408633/suspected-jihadists-killed-in-belgium-raid

    .

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 08:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    355
    Hmmm that is coming from “Todos somos Chavez” “El pueblo te saluda, Cuba, Cuba, Cuba”
    I thought so.

    What Videla did doesn’t even compare to the scale and size of the brutal communist and socialist dictators you endorse.

    And the “Green Falcon” saved far more people from the firing squads your terrorist parents would have commanded just like Che Guevara cleansed the
    Cuban people after the Revolution.
    But Stevie, it was us or your parents. The Swedes accommodated you as refugees just as the jihadists… Look how that turned out for the Swedes ??

    It’s not my fault that they are stupid and refuse to see this. There is no politically correct solution. In fact there is no problem hence there is no solution needed according to them.

    I havent got the cure for blank retardness.

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 08:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @346

    I had to Sky+ it but I shall catch it tomorrow, I have only seen the clips so far. If I can stomach it.

    It does not surprise me that it is the 'pull up the ladder' brigade. Or that the extremists are looking to hate something/one when they are really full of self-hatred.
    The malcontents and social misfits are ripe for exploitation by extremist groups for that very reason.

    I shall prepare to be sickened tomorrow.

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 08:26 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • CabezaDura2

    356.
    Me thinks Its only just begun. Belgium already has a growing Muslim party.
    Western Europe tinder box waiting to explode

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 08:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0
  • ElaineB

    @355 Oops, my last post was meant for you.

    Jan 15th, 2015 - 08:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0

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