MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Argentina is paradise: poverty below 5% rate Cristina Fernandez tells the world
Argentine President Cristina Fernández sparked controversy on Sunday when in a speech before the FAO conference in Rome, she endorsed widely disputed government figures on poverty, saying the rate was “below five percent,” adding that destitution in the country stood at 1.27%. If this was correct Argentina's poverty rate is below that of OECD rich league members. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesThere are lies, damned lies and RG statistics! One only has to take a short walk in BA or any other RG city to appreciate the scale of poverty. The shacks in the Villas, the gangs of weary Cartoneros everywhere after dark. The Indians begging everywhere.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 09:50 am - Link - Report abuse 0Lying is a national sport in RGland, but everyone knows its just lies. Which is why the constant whining about the mythical Malvinas that gets everyone giving knowing winks.
STOP
Jun 09th, 2015 - 10:10 am - Link - Report abuse 0LYING
YOU
FOOLISH
WOMAN
Yes... another statement to confirm .... She is insane..!!
Jun 09th, 2015 - 10:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0To her its the truth, she really believes it, therefore she doesn't regard it as lying!
Jun 09th, 2015 - 10:43 am - Link - Report abuse 0l think that its a national malaise.
There is no hope for Argentina,
No hope for Argentines.
And to think that they once had a vibrant, prosperous nation with such a bright future. All gone,
Sad.
And now l finally believe, at last, that they will never take over the Falklands.
Doesn't anyone check the reality before handing out awards? Surely it makes them meaningless when anyone having been to Argentina knows the huge level of poverty and deprivation. That CFK - Miss Rolex, dripping with gold and designer clothing - is oblivious should make the hungry and poverty stricken Argentines livid. Maybe they don't have the energy to protest.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 11:09 am - Link - Report abuse 0Then she got on her unicorn and traveled on rainbows back to LaLaLand.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 11:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0The scary part is she absolutely believes her own lies.
Pathological liar
CFK sparks poverty rate controversy
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:05 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“There seems to be disagreement even within the government with Lower House Speaker Julián Domínguez saying earlier this year that the country’s poverty rate stands at 14.9 percent.”
http://www.buenosairesherald.com/article/191192/cfk-sparks-poverty-rate-controversy
DILUSIONAL! Unbelievable that she hasn't been locked up--if not for increasingly insulting lies, then for the theft from Argentine citizens destruction of their ability to make a living! Is there no law that can remove her from office before she has her opposers “neutralized”?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I live in Argentina. The dictatorships she and her husband have perpetrated on the Argentine people have created one of the most poverty-stricken societies in any hemisphere of the world. That the United States of America has the temerity to consider Argentina a democracy is ludicrous.
I'm anxiuosly awaiting for Enrique Massot posts....
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And Kiss-off says that inflation is only 18%. Within the grounds of the National University of Cuyo, which is just across the street from where I live, there are several dozen shacks occupied by poor people. By shacks I mean tin and cardboard and plastic sheeting. They have been there for years. There is even a small playground for children. No running water, no sewers, no gas. Electricity stolen from the university. You don't have to go very far to find a barrio similar to this one...they are everywhere. This woman has absolutely no shame. Time for some real action in this country. Wake up people...look around you. The elections are coming...use your head for once.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0cretin:
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 01 informal, A stupid person (used as a general term of abuse).
2 medicine, A person who is deformed and mentally handicapped because of congenital thyroid deficiency.
Cretina:
A female president of rotting roadkill exhibiting one or both of the the traits above.
What CFK says is a LIE
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0LIER
LIER
Damn you, lier !
What say ye Reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeekie?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 12:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Reeeekie writes: “Here It is, all the issues of a nation of forty-some million people explained in just seven words. We are all liars.”
http://en.mercopress.com/2015/05/15/cristina-fernandez-comes-out-strongly-in-defense-of-minister-kicillof
Can one of the Kidiots (Reekie, Axel, you know who you are) 'splain me why there's a general strike today?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In the real world people only strike when they're unhappy.
This made me giggle today...Austral Elvis is hopin' and a wishin' to pay 30% on the next bond offer....
30%!!
Bahahahahaha
Psst that's less than inflation and the going rate for wage increase this year.
“splain it to me”
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0lol.
”Cristina Fernández...accepted a (FAO) award that was given to Argentina for being one of the countries in which malnutrition levels are below five percent.“
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”FAO Director-General José Graziano Silva commended the President for Argentina’s “outstanding” progress in fighting hunger.”
This is the story.
Reeeekie, you know that Cretina is lying. Reject the untruths. Be a man. Embrace veritas. Decry her falsehoods.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@16 No that is the K's spin.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I know you have not been to Buenos Aires for decades (or maybe ever) but there are plenty of pictures you can see of the 3 million living in absolute squalor in the villas there. Move out to the northern provinces and you see absolute poverty. You should go and see for yourself.
How CFK can lie so easily and blatantly is the story.
@16
Jun 09th, 2015 - 01:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0In the meanwhile poor kids still die in the poorest peronist provinces due to malnutrition. But they are from native small groups so, according to Diana Conti (a fascist peronist representative) they suffer from famine due to cultural issues.
We might keep on blaming Julio Argentino Roca about these deads. He passed away almost a hundred years from now but he is still a good scape-goat. Don't miss that chance
Enrique taking into account that Canada has a little bit more than 10% of its population under poverty conditions poverty and Argentina has half of it it might be time for you to move from Canada to our beloved country.
First the Argentine government is embarrassed by the exploding poverty rate and so it stops collecting and publishing the statistics. Meanwhile private agencies indicate between 25 and 30 percent poverty in Argentina. Then the Argentine government says that publishing the statistics would be politically incorrect. Then Cristina invents a totally false statistic that nobody believes, confirming the widespread belief that Stalin is alive and well in the Casa Rosada.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 02:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@16
Jun 09th, 2015 - 02:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Don't worry Alberto Fernández backed CFK comments about poverty in Argentina by saying that “Germany has more structural poverty than Argentina”. So it must be true after all.
They are so cinic. They are like Adolf Hitler informing his people that they were winning a war that was in the outskirts of Berlin.
Enrique, you are clearly a fascist that denny reality, make fun of poor people but live in a cozzy true First World country. Shame on you !!!!
Listen to the human excrement Anibal Fernandez telling the Argentine people that there is more poverty in Germany and Scandinavia than in Argentina:
Jun 09th, 2015 - 02:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xj3UYnLkKpw
Reeekie:
Jun 09th, 2015 - 02:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It seems that the lies of the president of your ex-country are coming home to roost.
Reeeekie writes: “Here It is, all the issues of a nation of forty-some million people explained in just seven words. We are all liars.”
http://en.mercopress.com/2015/05/15/cristina-fernandez-comes-out-strongly-in-defense-of-minister-kicillof
@22
Jun 09th, 2015 - 02:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If Anibal Fernandez win the next eletcion in the province of Buenos Aires it will become a “narco” province.
@16 Poverty has increased dramatically. There are children that are sent out to panhandle in the square to get whatever they can for their parents. This does not happen in countries with low poverty rates, nor would it be tolerated.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are too much of a coward to witness it for yourself, and your opinions are invalid.
Meanwhile... Axel is blearily typing his missive one character at a time from his desk at the school. Think is in rehab recovering from alcohol poisoning and Voice is having a kip after a hard luchtimes' swigging down at the Combined Services. Where are the trolls to defend CFK?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What a ludicrous speech from a serial liar? Animal Farm was a paradise compared to Argentina, only now defended by fools like Enrique who have no idea whatsoever what its like there, and blindly defend the corrupt Argentinian establishment.
Propaganda that even might make North Korea blush...
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:06 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Such an outrageous lie...
Enrique Massot and PaulCedron are noticeably silent...
Remember the Ks establish what the poverty line is. It was 6 pesos a day but that was a long time ago and at 30% inflation and daily peso devaluation that figure should have been updated.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It hasn't been
They don't report poverty numbers any longer
Estimates are as high as 36%
They'll be over 50% soon enough.
Then the Street fighting will commence
:)
Argentina is a paradise. It's just been really unfortunate with its political leaders.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well, she met the Pope recently, perhaps he offered her a 2 for 1 deal on confessions and this pack of lies is the result?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 03:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If there really was a vengeful God up there surely a thunderbolt would strike her down in mid speech?
@29
Jun 09th, 2015 - 05:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina is not the paradise. Argentina is a country like any other in the World.It has good things and bad ones.
It has not been unfortunate with its political leaders. Argentine political leaders are the reflection of argentine people. We are responsible for them. We. ONLY WE ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR HAVING THEM RULING THE COUNTRY.
@16. No Reekie, the 'story' is that she's a lying Kow. What would you know about it? You're about 6,000 miles away! Go 'home' and look for yourself. Why is there a major strike today? People only strike when they aren't happy. Kirchner has created a paradise and the people aren't happy? Ungrateful swine. Have you bought yourself a grave plot? Get in, lie down and pull it in. Save you looking at reality.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You seem to have 'the argie disease'. There are a number of symptoms. First, you're gutless. You lie a lot. You are incapable of facing reality. You run away and live far away from 'the paradise'. Everything your Fuhrer says is total truth whilst those who oppose her dictatorial regime are all liars. Yes, I said 'Fuhrer'. I've been watching programmes about Hitler. Always on the move. Always opening things. Always making speeches. Always leading rallies. No press conferences. No questions. If there are questions, there are no answers. If you find all that acceptable, how did you get into Canada?
Where is “Think” or as I tag him Lunatic.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 05:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0He was on another topic crowing about this pile of BS and saying he was 'happy'.
This proves conclusively how bat-shit mad the K argies are.
Looks like the K rats are cornered, no way out but to admit the truth.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 06:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@19 pgerman
Jun 09th, 2015 - 06:54 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Just a little clarification as per “poverty conditions” ( I am sure that you are aware of all of this, but for the benefit of others here .......)
While the OECD lists the “poverty rate” as 10.8% as per Statistics Canada, that value is actually a “low income cut-off” percentage (as per Statistics Canada), which is strictly an internally (national) relative measure and utterly useless when comparing “poverty rates” amongst countries; as it is grossly over-inflated compared to the means of measurement employed by the majority of other countries.
A “basic needs poverty measure”, which is (more) absolute, but certainly not perfect, is much more indicative of a country's general situation concerning such matters. In Canada that rate, most recently, was 4.7% (Fraser Institute; certainly not unbiased, but peer-reviewed). That being said, of those 4.7% in poverty, over 95% owned a colour TV and refrigerator, over 70% owned a dishwasher, more than half owned a car, and about a third owned their own home. Today, a two-parent family, with two children, on complete income assistance, will receive on average approximately $26,500.00 Cdn (or about 200,000 pesos at the official Argentine rate) in welfare payments along with various other tax credits and subsidies; including complete coverage of medical, dental, prescriptions (glasses etc) and all school fees.
How that compares with Argentina, I have absolutely no idea and therefore would not hazard a guess.
D
Check out the statistics Germany vs Argentina.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 07:11 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Makes a mockery out of what our lying cunt of a president is saying.
http://www.lanacion.com.ar/1800207-cual-es-la-real-diferencia-entre-alemania-y-argentina-segun-los-indicadores-sociales-de-la-onu
@35 Derke
Jun 09th, 2015 - 07:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Clarification: “$26,500.00 Cdn per annum”
My apologies.
Int'l opinion writers are all making fun of CFK over these idiotic statements.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 07:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Day in and day out Argentina becomes the laughing stock of the world.
The General Strike went well today. BA looks like a ghost town.
All is well, all is well.
;)
#16 Henry...is that why children are starving in Formosa? http://www.argentinaindependent.com/currentaffairs/newsfromargentina/chaco-qom-child-dies-of-tuberculosis-and-malnutrition/
Jun 09th, 2015 - 08:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Have we now reached a threshold as to the level of idiocy that the rotting roadkill trolls are willing to support?
Jun 09th, 2015 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0@38 Yes I was stuck on the freeway for 2 hours this morning.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 08:50 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Was good though when I went into town this afternoon. No waiting at RENAR :)
This graph:
Jun 09th, 2015 - 08:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.google.com.ar/publicdata/explore?ds=d5bncppjof8f9_&met_y=ny_gdp_pcap_cd&idim=country:DEU:GBR:FRA&hl=en&dl=en#!ctype=l&strail=false&bcs=d&nselm=h&met_y=ny_gdp_pcap_kd&scale_y=lin&ind_y=false&rdim=region&idim=country:DEU:ARG:FIN:DNK:NOR&ifdim=region&hl=en_US&dl=en&ind=false
shows how the countries in question have developed economically since 1960 and how Argentina hasn't evolved at all. Anibaul should be in jail.
A KEYNESSIAN ARGENTINA FOR EVER.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 09:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's expectable that some imbeciles think that some of us believe that the country is a paradise, in the same way that we will find many ignorants, whose knowledge about the causes of our problems is always too partial, will continue to invalid everything that was done by kirchnerism in the last 12 years, beside at the same time, those reactionaries dare to tell us what we should do.
Although everybody has right to believe in any statistic, beyond how little reliable some of them are, all those people who usually invalid the policies of kirchnerism, should see some day that there are other facts, which are much more relevant than what any statistic can say.
If Argentina's social situation improved just a little, after 26 years of very bad policies, which took the country to start XXI century in the conditions of a beggar, we still would have a high number of argentines who leave the nation, as it used to happen in the 90's, or during and after the 2001 crisis.
On the other hand, kirchnerism wouldn't have ruled the nation for 3 periods, which is a record since 1983, beside, it wouldn't have big chances of winning in october, otherwise, the most powerful mediatic corporations of the country, wouldn't ask Massa desperately to form a big coallition with Macri, in order to try to win f. p.v
I recommend you to search in google, El perfil migratorio de la Argentina 2012 (migratory profile of Argentina 2012), it's a huge document, which i had to study for my professor place, where you'll see what were the consecuences of the policies applied in the last 12 years, beside, you'll know also about the migratory behaviour of the argentines along our history, etc.
Anyway, it's too obvious that there is still a very dark side in our social situation, in fact, we still have a 33% of workers who don't have any social safe, and there are also a few populations who are too isolated, and who suffer some of the most terrible deseases.
42. That is a very telling graph.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 09:32 pm - Link - Report abuse 0How sad it is to be an Argentinian.
You are stuck in the pas while the rest of the world moves on.
The worse part is there's nothing that will change that and Rgs be poorer and dumber next year than they were this year, last year, last decade, last generation and so on and so on.
@43 axel arg
Jun 09th, 2015 - 10:02 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not even John Maynard Keynes argued that a country should be 'Keynsian' forever. Only people who hasn't understood Keynsianism - like Kiciloff - would argue such foolishness.
Keynes idea was that only the state can break the vicious circle of downturn -> austerity -> more downturn, NOT that the state always should be the guarantor of economic growth. That's called socialism and has never worked.
The Chilean news media is currently reacting to the news and its embarrassing to whatever dignity and prestige of Argentina. In general Chileans have had in the past a certain measure of revulsion for CFK, but now after this stupidity I think we have far more respect for Bolivia and North Korea.
Jun 09th, 2015 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Someone tell George Bush we found the WMD. It is in the casa Rosada covered in botox.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 12:54 am - Link - Report abuse 0She's up there with Mugabe now.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 01:48 am - Link - Report abuse 0Where's Paulie? He must have some insight on this. ;-)
#48
Jun 10th, 2015 - 02:14 am - Link - Report abuse 0I'm afraid that I must respectfully disagree.
Mugabe is a far more trustable dictator to settle with.
Wait until the Puerto Argentina and puerto Madero begin operations...
How can one define her ever more?? Pure evil, moronic or just an outright liar???
Jun 10th, 2015 - 02:48 am - Link - Report abuse 050
Jun 10th, 2015 - 03:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0the definition would be hija de puta.
not so moronic, since she, her whole fucking family and all her minions have become ultra-rich, coming from a lower-middle class background in general .
isolda
“And now l finally believe, at last, that they will never take over the Falklands.”
and what the heck have the islets got to do with this issue, eh?
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/soccer-fc-yahoo/australian-soccer-website-says-the-uswnt--just-aren-t-that-good-044522277.html
Jun 10th, 2015 - 05:28 am - Link - Report abuse 0Ozzers and NorthAmoans going at it in a sport no one cares about, priceless.
@25 Optimus_Princeps:
Jun 10th, 2015 - 07:44 am - Link - Report abuse 0In 1993, when I arrived in Argentina, there was not a single street begging urchin to be seen . . . anywhere, any time! As for Security, on my first night in Buenos Aires I went out with friends to dinner and then drinks until 4 in the morning. On leaving a slum bar into the often unlit streets of the worst neighborhood, La Boca, I'll never forget the amazement that overwhelmed me on seeing two outrageously beautiful mid-teenage girls, dressed in the flimsiest of disco dresses, clearly real jewels at her throats, wrists and precariously high-heeled ankles, as they sang, arms around each other, quite steadily and unhurriedly walking by us on the cobblestoned street. We offered them a ride home (no taxi in sight) but they thanked us, saying that on such a glorious summer night they wanted to walk to their homes in posh La Recoleta.
Now, as in New York of the 1980s, even in broad daylight police only sally forth in most neighborhoods of BA in groups of 2 to 5 . . . thanks to the Lowest-Common-Denominator of any society, anywhere, Mad Queen Cristina, guilty of on-going Crimes Against Humanity. Unfortunately, she's where she is because she is not such an oddity among Argentines. The criminal strain, there since Italy first expulsed their worst criminals to people the New World--just as England sent their worst to the U.S. and Australia--has crawled out from all strata of Argentine society.
Long live the Queen! Off with her head!
@51 paulcedron, nabolito,
Jun 10th, 2015 - 07:49 am - Link - Report abuse 0lt means, O stupid, foul-mouthed one, that l finally realised that you shower of misogynist mis-fits are far more incompetent than l had first thought.
Add to that brew, that you are proven liars too & it now becomes clear that you do not have the capability nor the intelligence to pose ANY threat to us at all.
Got it?
ldiot child.
“Ozzers and NorthAmoans going at it in a sport no one cares about, priceless”
Jun 10th, 2015 - 09:01 am - Link - Report abuse 0Off topic. But I totally agree.
31 Ok, Argentina is unfortunate with its people. Started out Ok but then boat loads of Spaniards and Italians arrived. See what you mean.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 11:59 am - Link - Report abuse 0isolda...isolda
Jun 10th, 2015 - 12:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0what a big, big disappointment you are.
the saddest thing is that you lot always want to be the center of attention and playing the victim.
again, THIS issue has nothing to do with the islets.
got it?
mon dieu...
Paul the relationship to CFK's crazy rantings about Poverty is the same as her crazy rantings about the Falklands.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 01:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Both are delusional and show her to be a dangerous fool.
Playing the victim?
Jun 10th, 2015 - 01:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Out of the mouth of babes!
Reeeeeekie - the abscence of an adequate explanation as to the magical disappearance of the starving masses of rotting roadkill is noted.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 05:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It would be pretentious of me to pretend Argentina is a paradise. Hey, even in well-developed countries such as Canada you find atrocious situations, especially in First Nations communities.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 06:47 pm - Link - Report abuse 0However, after checking the work of Néstor Kirchner and Cristina Fernández, I found they have taken real, concrete measures to improve the lot of the most impoverished, such as the Universal Child Allowance and access-to-housing programs--something I had seen in Europe and Canada but never expected to live to see it in my home country.
Have the Kirchners eliminated poverty? Not by any means.
Have they made progress in reducing it? Yessir!
Let's not stop at Cristina's words and check the World Bank statistics (I trust they're not Kirchnerists).
In 2002, the poor made up 45.5 per cent of the population.
2006: 20.5 per cent
2009: 16.3 per cent
2011: 11.6 per cent
Now, it's interesting to see the following graphic down the page you can check by following the link below:
INEQUALITY TREND
Distribution of income or consumption by quintile:
In 2002, the richest 20 per cent of the population got 57.8 per cent of the national income or consumption.
In 2011, the same 20 per cent got 48.7 per cent.
That's where the rub is.
http://povertydata.worldbank.org/poverty/country/ARG
Except Reekie, Poverty in Argentina is really about 36% of the population after the so called “won decade” and more people are entering it every single hour of the day due to the 2nd highest inflation rate in the hemisphere.
Jun 10th, 2015 - 06:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Filthy propagandist.
Argentina comes to a halt as transport unions shut-down buses, trains, subways, air traffic,,,,,,
Jun 10th, 2015 - 06:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Argentina is paradise,, lol
LOL. Reeekie earns it!
Jun 10th, 2015 - 07:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Reeeekie writes: “Here It is, all the issues of a nation of forty-some million people explained in just seven words. We are all liars.”
http://en.mercopress.com/2015/05/15/cristina-fernandez-comes-out-strongly-in-defense-of-minister-kicillof
#61 Enrique Massot
Jun 10th, 2015 - 08:07 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And where do you think the World Bank gathered their statistics?
INDEC
The same source of current government figures showing the poverty rate is currently “below five percent”...
As you have been repeatedly quoted: “Here It is, all the issues of a nation of forty-some million people explained in just seven words. We are all liars.”
@65
Jun 10th, 2015 - 09:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The World Bank gets its info from INDEC and since blatant obfuscation of public stats hardly happen anywhere else, they publish this garbage rather than the more appropriate N/A.
Interestingly, Argentine poverty will be absent in the next World Bank stat update since not even INDEC can cover up the situation any longer. Hence evil Axel's infamous “we won't publish poverty stats any longer since they are stigmatizing towards poor people” (You can't make this sh*t up)
Here is a breakdown, province for province, of Argentine poverty. Average poverty is approximately 35%:
twitter.com/EVALUECON/status/607977161132285953/photo/1
#66 Jonaz
Jun 10th, 2015 - 10:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thank you for the link. Last time I was in Mendoza the poverty was visibly worse as many farm workers were underemployed due to the wine crisis. In the early 70's when I first visited there, it was far more prosperous than Chile.
”Let's not stop at Cristina's words and check the World Bank statistics (I trust they're not Kirchnerists).”
Jun 10th, 2015 - 11:39 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Told you..... a little slow.
The buzz in Argentina right now of course it that once again, Kretina is the hazmereir of all of Latin America.
Jun 11th, 2015 - 01:52 am - Link - Report abuse 0And if you can read argententis, here is one of the comments describing the presidenta's lies as, well, lies:
“Las cifras sobre la pobreza son mentirosas”, afirmó el sacerdote a cargado de Cáritas en Misiones”
And an article on a prosecutor's investigation into malnutrition in the province of Tucumán (apparently the provincial government is more willing to admit to the thousands of cases of malnutrition which the national government wishes to ignore) :
“Una fiscal abrió una investigación por los casos de desnutrición en Tucumán”
Private estimates of conditions in Tucumán province indicate well over 40 percent of the population there is considered in poverty.
#69 Marti
Jun 11th, 2015 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0The media here in Chile hardly made mention of CFK's ridiculous claims as we're used to our neighbor's lack of truth. What gets her quoted on the front pages here however is when she actually says something truthful, it's big news.
Check out the photos of the slums in Berlin.
Jun 11th, 2015 - 01:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0http://baexpats.org/topic/33652-argentina-less-poverty-than-germany-and-many-nordic-states/
#71 chronic
Jun 11th, 2015 - 02:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0The photograph of the poor poverty stricken Germans in Villa Einunddreibig is heart breaking. Merkel should be ashamed of herself for not generously assisting the starving children like CFK does.
;)
Argentina is paradise: poverty below 5% rate Cristina Fernandez tells the world.
Jun 11th, 2015 - 07:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0........and if YOU believe anything that she says then you are a bigger fool than she is!!
#Chicureo . . . “The media here in Chile hardly made mention of CFK's ridiculous claims as we're used to our neighbor's lack of truth. What gets her quoted on the front pages here however is when she actually says something truthful, it's big news.”
Jun 11th, 2015 - 09:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Todos esperan ansiosamente tu respuesta: ¿En qué año ocurrió ese anomalía?
I'm sure it's paradise if you happen to like slums.
Jun 12th, 2015 - 11:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0http://panampost.com/panam-staff/2015/06/12/catholic-church-quarter-of-argentineans-in-poverty/
Jun 12th, 2015 - 09:16 pm - Link - Report abuse 0¡Gracias 76 Chronic! . . . para el artículo en panampost:
Jun 13th, 2015 - 12:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0panampost.com/panam-staff/2015/06/12/catholic-church-quarter-of-argentineans-in-poverty/
Raise your hand everyone who believes her. I'm afraid I don't, for some reason.
Jun 13th, 2015 - 12:33 am - Link - Report abuse 0It is actually advantageous that Cristina, Timerman, Kicillof, and the others make such well publicised public statements that every sensible person realises are absurdly preposterous and dismally false, because it reminds every sentient being that Argentina is simply a massive joke, a nation led by clowns, unworthy of investment, and clearly unsuitable for any sort or trust or confidence. Small wonder that Argentina is considered the North Korea of South America.
Jun 13th, 2015 - 12:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0@79 You're leaving out that the old timers were allied with nazis in peronism and the trio you mentioned are all jewish. As is the head of the peronist party Fellner. Governers of Chaco...Tucuman...where the pesticide genocide is a fact.
Jun 13th, 2015 - 04:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0SPANISH:
Jun 13th, 2015 - 10:00 am - Link - Report abuse 0(Para los que no lo entiende de inmediato, la foto de “Einunderdreibig” es satírica. En realidad es una foto de los barrios bajos Retiro de la capital argentina, con adiciones photoshopped de la bandera alemana y una pequeña familia alemana dulce, pantalones de cuero, dirndls y todo)
ENGLISH:
(For those who don't get it right away, the photo of “Einunderdreibig” is satirical. It's actually a photo of the Argentine capital's Retiro slums, with photoshopped additions of the German flag and a sweet little German family, lederhosen, dirndls and all)
When I finished my secondary education, I took a bus to Buenos Aires (roughly 18 hours from Santiago) and not once did I see slums that now are throughout the country. In the 70s Chile was 6 times poorer that our neighbor. Today we have the highest per capita income in a country with far fewer natural resources.
Jun 14th, 2015 - 02:20 am - Link - Report abuse 0It's criminal how their politicians have squandered as well as plundered their national patrimony.
JONAZ_BSAS (45).
Jun 14th, 2015 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Sorry Jonaz, but i stopped believing many years ago that the market solves the problems of poverty,unemployment, etc, beside, i don't even trust our businessmen, and i have a mountain of reasons to distrust them, i only believe in the state.
It's evident that you haven't seen yet that in a world like the actual one, which is handled mostly by the casino economy, where the financial crisis, that started in 2008, the bad economic situations of Arg'.s main trade partners are prejudicing our trade seriously, and in a context where the prices of the commodities that we export are lowering, if we didn't have a strong statal intervention, or if the government implemented some of the austerity plans like inEurope, we would have a big number of unemployed people like in the 90's.
CHICUREO (82).
If you are a pro liberal, i respect it, but if you want to give opinions about Arg.'s social situation, it would be better for you to investigate much more about it, instead of buying so easily the reactionary view, characteristic of the hegemonical press. In my comment 43, i make an ample lecture about our social problems.
Beside, stop comparing your country with Arg., haven't you seen that both economies, and the history of the two nations are absolutly different?, can't you see that it's a too ignorant comparison?.
On the other hand, be more honest please, while it is true that Chile improved it's social situation so much since it recovered the democracy in 1990, it's also true that you have many pendent debts like Arg., in fact, you don't have something so basic like free universitary education, beside, the unequality of incomes is much bigger there than in Argentina, etc, etc.
@83 In Chile we can order goods internationally via the internet and not get permission first from the government - as in Argentina. In Chile the government does not try to prosecute us for publishing economic data that differ from the false “official” numbers -- as in Argentina. In Chile we have a higher per-capita income than in Argentina. In Chile the government does not lie to the extent that Argentina and its INDEC do about its economic conditions and poverty rates. In Chile we can freely trade our local currency for US dollars -- unlike Argentina, where you have to get permission from the government to trade nearly worthless ARS for real currencies. In Chile we have a problem with theft but the rates are nowhere near those of Argentina, where the rates of theft are the highest in the Western Hemisphere. In Chile the government pays about 4.5 percent for sovereign bond loans, while in Argentina, well, since Argentina has been in default for most of the past 200 years and nobody in the international community really trusts Argentina to repay its loans, Argentina is pretty much not getting any sort of loans from anybody but China and Venezuela, and then only for very high interest rates that reflect the extreme risks in doing any sort of business with an unreliable country that can't seem to tell the truth or honour its obligations anywhere. Si sos argentino, no podés decir la verdad, ni siquiera a ti mismo.
Jun 14th, 2015 - 06:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0#84 Marti Llazo . . . Two things: one, if I may, your last sentence above should have one word changed, and then it would be perfect! (Si sos argentino, no puedes decir la verdad, ESPECIALMENTE a ti mismo!)
Jun 14th, 2015 - 06:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Two: You forgot . . . Visiting Chile is to be embraced by nice people who really practice cariño. To visit Argentina is to be embraced for hidden motives (if not at the moment, betrayal is a short way down the road.
An Argentine on the river bank, to anyone swimming by: “Oh stranger, I cannot swim and must get to the other side. Please carry me across.” . . . Long story, short: eventually the passerby agrees, even recognizing that it's an Argentine! Mid-river, the Good Samaritan finds he's been stabbed, to rob him of fifteen pesos. Asking his passenger just before they both drown, “Why???!!! The Argentine shrugs complacently and says, ”It's just my nature!”
#84 Marti
Jun 14th, 2015 - 06:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Well said!
#83 Axel
I'm a liberal conservative member of the Renovation Nacional party, and although Bachelet's new tax policy is seriously harming Chile's economy, but don't think she had any knowledge of her son's stupidity.
As Marti explained, our exterior debts are very manageable. Chile also maintains an emergency rainy day fund that currently is in excess of 15 billion Dollars and our central bank is probably the most respected in Latin America. There is no ridiculous currency controls or exchange rates and anything exported is not taxed. Chile's AA- S&P credit rating is the highest in the Latin America. China is our largest trading partner, but they also pay us in Dollars.
The truth is that my very imperfect country has a great deal of work still to solve the social inequality here, including vast improvement of public education, public health care and fully care for those who need assistance. Unlike Argentina, Chile does not have the tremendous natural resources, farmland or developed industry, but we're not squandering our wealth away either.
I remember well, during the UP, waiting in line outside our “supermarket” with a ration book, to buy our allotted rations of basic foodstuffs in 1973. My father would return from business trips abroad with compressed rolls of toilet paper and everyone was living in uncertainty. Chile was bankrupt and your country was prosperous. So yes, I think it's a good idea to scold you all from time to time as your countrymen continue to support the same ymafia of thieving populist politicians.
Australia is a civilized developed country and they estimate13.9% of their people are living below the poverty line, where as your contemptible president claims her country's poverty rate is less than 5%. People should be throwing bricks at the Casa Rosada for that.
@85 In an earlier version of the parable you cite, in which the Good Samaritan or equivalent is deceived and mortally so, the one doing the deceiving was a snake (“ I'm a snake - it's what snakes do.” ). Víbora, argentino -- me da lo mismo, son todos de la misma raza. O como dijo el ex presidente uruguayo (Batlle) “Los argentinos son una manga de ladrones, del primero hasta el último.”
Jun 14th, 2015 - 09:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Dear Marti Llazo,
Jun 14th, 2015 - 10:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I'd never heard the parable with a snake; I heard it as the frog and the scorpion, el Sapo y el Escorpión. ¡Larga vida, Presidente Batlle! (Espero que el presidente actual de Uruguay, Tabaré Vasquez, es tan honesto en sus opiniones.) Viví 17 años en ese condenado país, Argentina, y por primera vez en mi vida me encuentro prejuiciado . . . no contra los individuos que cruzan mi camino sino en general.
@88/Estimado PhraseWizard: The story of the snake is summarised in wikipedia and is easily understood to be a parable relating to the Argentines:
Jun 14th, 2015 - 11:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“The Farmer and the Viper is one of Aesop's Fables..... It has the moral that kindness to the evil will be met by betrayal and is the source of the idiom 'to nourish a viper in one's bosom'.
The story concerns a farmer who finds an argento [a viper] freezing in the snow. Taking pity on it, he picks it up and places it within his coat. The argento [the viper], revived by the warmth, bites his rescuer, who dies realizing that it is his own fault. The story is recorded in both Greek and Latin sources. In the former, the farmer dies reproaching himself ” for pitying a scoundrel,“ while in the version by Phaedrus the snake says that he bit his benefactor ”to teach the lesson not to expect a reward from the wicked.”
In much the same way we see the behavior of the Argentines in modern times. Those who loan them money, or invest in that country, are soon bitten -- either by the expropriation of investor property, or refusal by Argentina to repay debts according to the terms of the loans, or some other artifact of deceit and/or corruption.
Well said, well written, Marti Llazo. Thank you. I hope both Argentines and others read what you've written above . . . as a word of caution for both the viper and the passersby: for Argentines to fear the inevitable, ongoing backlash; for all the farmers in the world, that neither their hearts nor their minds are safe from Argentines, certainly not their property or family members.
Jun 14th, 2015 - 11:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0This is by far the best thread I have read on here for a long time .
Jun 15th, 2015 - 05:25 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Anyway , this short film shows what it it is like to try to live on 6 pesos a day :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VZvE8vh1Lw
According to Anibal Fernandez there is more poverty in Germany and Scandinavia than in Argentina.
Jun 15th, 2015 - 08:19 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If you use the INDEC method to generate values, poverty in those countries is -22% and -21%
@92 If we use the INDEC for anything, it will always turn up garbage, sort of like listening to a North Korean propaganda minister.
Jun 15th, 2015 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Commenting for this story is now closed.
If you have a Facebook account, become a fan and comment on our Facebook Page!