MercoPress. South Atlantic News Agency
Malcorra downplays possibility of Falklands requesting visa for Argentine visitors
Argentine foreign minister downplayed the news that the Falkland Islands could impose a visa system for Argentines visiting the Islands, although admitting the ministry is following the issue closely and insisted that confidence building with the local population takes time. Read full article
Comments
Disclaimer & comment rulesWhat “confidence building”? And as far as I can see, CFK having broken all the 90's agreements anyway, the FIG not only have the right, but the responsibility, to prevent undesirables landing in their territory.
May 03rd, 2017 - 08:01 am - Link - Report abuse +10Mr.Lorton...
May 03rd, 2017 - 08:47 am - Link - Report abuse -10Please do read the Malvinas Colonial “Constitution”...
The right & responsibility to allow or prevent any landings in the so-called British Overseas Territory of Malvinas (sic) lies entirey at the Foreign & Colonial Office - Room K196 - King Charles Street - SW1A 2AH - London - United Kingdom....
(For you orientation..., that's ~101 miles southeast from Brum's Post House Vaults...;-)
Incorrect, immigration policy is devolved to the Falkland Islands Government. When the agreement to allow Argentines into the Falklands was made, HMG had to persuade FIG to allow it.
May 03rd, 2017 - 08:49 am - Link - Report abuse +12Malcorra - Transplanted population MercoPress 10 Nov 2016.
May 03rd, 2017 - 09:14 am - Link - Report abuse +7Malcorra said that historically the Argentine position was not to acknowledge for this case in particular the “self determination of peoples”, because 'kelpers' (Falkland Islanders) are a transplanted population, not aborigine.
Hm. Let's see: Falklands – Implanted Population:
https://www.academia.edu/30505159/Falklands_Implanted_Population
Ahhhhhhhhh....
May 03rd, 2017 - 09:15 am - Link - Report abuse -7Mr. Justin(hismind)Kuntz...
I see you have matured some since last... No insults...! (yet)
Sorry to ruin your party but... You are right about “immigration” but wrong about tourist stays under 30 days...
And we are here speaking about tourist stays under 30 days..., lad...
But don't take me word for it...
Google it ;-)))
“I seriously doubt that the United Kingdom is thinking about this, ” said Foreign Minister Susana Malcorra before the news about the kelpers and their implementation of the visa to Argentines who want to travel to the Falkland Islands.
May 03rd, 2017 - 09:35 am - Link - Report abuse +4According to the report, the national government flatly rejected the idea, although the intention of some Malvinas lawmakers continues with “concern”. The Chancellor said that before the rumor that the kelpers advance with the idea, there is a unique position in the Pink House: “That is not a local decision of the government of the Malvinas Islands, but of the government of the United Kingdom”.
In this way, Malcorra flatly rejected not only the idea of the kelpers but also the unilateral decision of the islanders to make a determination without the prior consent of London. The chancellor appealed to the double reason why the initiative could not transcend.
Even if it could be voted on in the local Assembly, that resolution would have no legal value, since the decision will remain exclusive to the United Kingdom. That is, the statement of the kelpers would merely be a political announcement, similar to the referendum they organized years ago to reaffirm their membership in the British Empire.
Why not search Argies when they arrive to see if they have any offensive material on their person.
May 03rd, 2017 - 10:50 am - Link - Report abuse +6Think- I think you would find that if the FI Assembly voted for this- then it would happen- Umpteen UK Governments have said for years that the Islanders have the right to decide who and how their Govt works.
May 03rd, 2017 - 10:58 am - Link - Report abuse +9Perhaps more relevant is that Argentina needs to do something to sort out the bad behaviour and unfriendly actions of some of those your taxes go towards the flights and costs of coming over here.
Tell me- if you go into your local shops in your local small town - cafes-etc and find big groups of people in there speaking in English- wearing clothes with Falklands flags printed on them and slogans saying the Falkland Islands are British etc etc- and painting British and Falklands flags on rocks in your parkland areas etc etc, waving big Falklands flags about in public areas- would you get a bit pissed off?
Now, now Think, as us old men know - there's always more than one way to skin a cat :-)
May 03rd, 2017 - 11:00 am - Link - Report abuse +5Mr. Lorton...
May 03rd, 2017 - 11:40 am - Link - Report abuse -7It would suit me fine if them Kelpers went ahead with the public skinning of this alive cat...
That's exactly what the Engrish need in these chaotic BREXIT times...;-)
Mr. Islander1...
You say....:
《“Tell me- if you go into your local shops in your local small town - cafes-etc and find big groups of people in there speaking in English- wearing clothes with Falklands flags printed on them and slogans saying the Falkland Islands are British etc etc- and painting British and Falklands flags on rocks in your parkland areas etc etc, waving big Falklands flags about in public areas- would you get a bit pissed off?”》
I say...:
Well... You just described exactly what's going on on a small piece of my Patagonia called Islas Malvinas...
Of course I'm pissed off...!
By the way... congratulations with the new owners of the FIH/FIC...
The American Friends of Lubavitch (Chabad)...
Did the FIG(leaf) approve it...?
;-)))
Think- I am asking you to look at it- if this happened in YOUR little village/town etc. where you live and your family have maybe lived for several generations.
May 03rd, 2017 - 12:52 pm - Link - Report abuse +5FIH - depends who hold the 51% or more I guess.
Mr. Islander1...
May 03rd, 2017 - 02:13 pm - Link - Report abuse -7Patagonia may be bigger than France but we are no more than 1,4 million down here (including you bunch)...
Small cities as München..., Milano..., Philadelphia or even Birmingham have more inhabitants than us...
I Think that's Glocal enough to get pissed off by some Engrish flag wawing Colonialists sailing 10,000 miles down to steal our Country...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=uEx5G-GOS1k
About the FIH...
After yesterday's sale..., I would venture to say that the +50% of shares are already in Foreign hands...
Good grief... Even I have some via me Dover Trustee...;-)
I expect Mrs Malcorra is giving some thought as to why this has arisen at this stage, rather than trying to play the petty politics of some of the contributors on here.
May 03rd, 2017 - 02:32 pm - Link - Report abuse +6Either way she is wrong about jurisdiction. Immigration policy is the responsibility of the Falkland Islands Government.
Mr. GALlamosa...
May 03rd, 2017 - 03:19 pm - Link - Report abuse -6As I wrote above...:
” Sorry to ruin your party but... You are right about “immigration” but wrong about tourist stays under 30 days...
And we are here speaking about tourist stays under 30 days..., lad...
A pity..., because I would wish you could gave the three fingers salute to the Engrish and introduced your quotas against us Argies...
Bug you can't...
@Islander1
May 03rd, 2017 - 06:05 pm - Link - Report abuse +2How can Think imagine that? His parents came from a different continent and he hasn't spent his whole life living in the same small town either.
Why do you need visas anyway? Couldn't you just have a blacklist for the serious troublemakers and send them back on the plane if they tried to enter?
Demon Tree, won't work. Too many of them.
May 03rd, 2017 - 06:33 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Think- dodging thew question yet again- just asking you how would YOU personally feel in your local if the reverse happened regular. But no - you show the good old Colonialist Argentine arrogance- bugger how the locals feel - trample them and get them down- just goes to show if we were ever forced under Argentine Colonial rule then we - the Islanders people would probably end up meeting the same fate as the natural population of Patagonia did.
May 03rd, 2017 - 08:07 pm - Link - Report abuse +6Demon Tree- actually a list of those undesirables(P.N.G.s) is nearing completion and about to be activated, but need also to limit numbers per week to 25-30 approx. and a visa system would be simplest method of killing both birds with one shot.
@Islander1
May 03rd, 2017 - 09:16 pm - Link - Report abuse -3How many people are on this list? Is it just a few or 10's or 100's?
This seems like kind of a bad time too, when relations are supposed to be improving. Wouldn't it be better to wait until CFK or someone similar is (re-)elected? Is Think right that the UK government has to agree?
Undesirables can be refused entry on landing Think ..... something in the remit of the FIG and not subject to the control of London. I suspect that “undesirable” covers about 40 million Argies.
May 03rd, 2017 - 10:38 pm - Link - Report abuse +4Mr. Lorton...
May 03rd, 2017 - 11:03 pm - Link - Report abuse -5From my point of wiev... there are about 2,700 “Undesirables” in the South Atlantic Mr. Lorton...
Speaking about them 2,700...
Wasn't the final result for the Island Census 2016 supposed to be public at the end of March...?
No idea Think, not something that concerns me. If there were only 2, they would still be a 'people.'
May 04th, 2017 - 02:57 am - Link - Report abuse +6Mr Roger Lorton...
May 04th, 2017 - 11:18 am - Link - Report abuse -4Yuppp....
That's right...
Hard facts are not something that concerns you...
By the way...
I was surprised finding your name in the local press* this morning...
http://www.cholilaonline.com/2017/05/malvinas-quieren-imponer-visa-de.html
- It basically says that a certain Roger Lorton..., a British citizen that dosen't reside in Malvinas nor Britain.., bullies..., together with a chap called Taff Davies, (aka Mr. Falkland) not only Argentineans on the social media... but also those residents in the Islands who Think differently...
Are you really morphing from local hero to local bully...?
From 1212 to 1312..?
*《“El caso Davies es muy singular, ya que bajo el mote de Mr Falkland se dedica a hacer bullying a los argentinos en las redes sociales. Actúa junto a otro ciudadano británico que no vive en las Malvinas ni tampoco en el Reino Unido, de nombre Roger Lorton. El problema es que también acosan a quien piensa diferente en Malvinas ”》
Wow...the infamous Roger Lorton...
May 04th, 2017 - 12:44 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Can I have an autograph...?
;-)))
May 04th, 2017 - 12:55 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Stolen from Cronica. Natasha is miffed that I threw her off the Facebook news page. Hell hath no fury ...... as they say ;-)
May 04th, 2017 - 01:24 pm - Link - Report abuse +2Heh, famous! Do you mean Clarin, Roger? One Taff Davies has been commenting on it there - in English. How come he never posts here?
May 04th, 2017 - 01:27 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Mr. Lorton...
May 04th, 2017 - 01:46 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Soooooooooooooooooo....
What you are saying is that you are the usual local hero being maliciously Niebieskikwiated...?
Saying? I couldn't even pronounce it.
May 04th, 2017 - 01:52 pm - Link - Report abuse +1;-)))
May 04th, 2017 - 02:02 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Think - do you ever revise your postings? (And feel just a little stupid because of the pile of nonsense you write?)
May 04th, 2017 - 08:40 pm - Link - Report abuse +4Demon Tree- Think is incorrect- all immigration tourist or to live and work is in the hands of Falkland Islands Government Customs and Immigration Dept. No doubt FIG would liase and discuss with London- but London would not overrule.
May 04th, 2017 - 11:18 pm - Link - Report abuse +3Know Taff Davis well - he is no more a bully than Natasha! Know her as well - both have their principles- fair enough. She has been here several times and gets to talk to our Assembly Members as she is generally open and straight in her reporting.
While you are awaiting the Islands' census information Think, you can always make do with the UN's Secretariat 2017 Working Paper. Embargoed yesterday so I moaned. Perhaps Natasha is right, and I actually have some influence ..... or just coincidence? The latter most likely. Anyway, today it appears so I've snaffled it in case they change their minds again.
May 05th, 2017 - 12:22 am - Link - Report abuse +1One thing that doesn't change, is that last paragraph .... been there well over a decade now. Surprising that no-one has put their hands up in all that time.
Don't you think - Think?
https://falklandstimeline.files.wordpress.com/2017/05/n1708299.pdf
You can always go through to the UN's search page, if you don't want to add to my stats :-)
England will return the Malvinas within 25 years.
May 05th, 2017 - 01:10 am - Link - Report abuse -5Spain will return Argentina to the indigenous people within 24 years.
May 05th, 2017 - 03:50 am - Link - Report abuse +7The Argentine authorities will return Hepatia to the “manicomio” within seven days!
May 05th, 2017 - 05:15 am - Link - Report abuse +3I hear the census is held up because Islanders haven't been returning the forms Think. Perhaps they're trying to hide? I AM NOT A NUMBER ......
May 05th, 2017 - 07:48 am - Link - Report abuse +1:-)
Colonials rebelling..., huhhhhhhhhhhhhh....
May 05th, 2017 - 11:02 am - Link - Report abuse -1Assemble them all in church ...
You Engrish know the rest...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=EtTljtBxtd0
You forgot the standard disclaimer:
May 05th, 2017 - 01:25 pm - Link - Report abuse +1“Any resemblance to real persons, living or dead, or actual events is purely coincidental.”
Very important for works of fiction that like one.
Mr.DemonTree...
May 05th, 2017 - 03:15 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh....
You prefer the “Real Engrish Stuff” huhhh...?
Bit “unpractical” 'cause Puerto Estanley lacks an appropriate enclosure but...
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=RXneJhU7XwE
Happy now...?
No local authority can modify what is established by a bilateral agreement. For the rest, if you wish to understand the sovereignty dispute, you can read:
May 05th, 2017 - 03:17 pm - Link - Report abuse -5http://www.malvinas-falklands.net
Mr. Lorton...
May 05th, 2017 - 06:31 pm - Link - Report abuse -3Speaking about hiding Kelpers...
Any news about the Lucy Faithfull Met Operation you are allowed to share...?
@Think
May 05th, 2017 - 08:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0No, I'm not. Why the hell did that guy want to shoot people who weren't even doing anything???
Marcelo Kohen
May 05th, 2017 - 09:43 pm - Link - Report abuse +3As much would like otherwise self-determination is erga omnes international law. Therefore, they are entitled to control who may or may not enter their domain.
Mr. DemonTree
May 05th, 2017 - 09:46 pm - Link - Report abuse -3Read your own history and grow up..., lad...
There are plenty good Engrish people who has documented it properly...
Golfcronie
May 05th, 2017 - 10:40 pm - Link - Report abuse +2“Why not search Argies when they arrive to see if they have any offensive material on their person”
How about searching them for anything offensive before they receive permission to travel to the Falklands, and again before they Board the plane?
Mr. Lorton...
May 05th, 2017 - 10:52 pm - Link - Report abuse -2Localy called “Operation Cinnamon”...
Think, I'm a one trick pony ... if it isn't in the South Atlantic and in the 19th century, I've never heard of it :-)
May 05th, 2017 - 11:46 pm - Link - Report abuse +1Mr. Lorton...
May 06th, 2017 - 12:13 am - Link - Report abuse -2I understand...
Engrish Omertà...
We'll have to wait and see then...
The Republic of Argentina signed the UN Charter on 26 June 1945. Under the UN Charter and Article One of the UN Covenant of Human Rights the people who live on the islands have the right to self-determination. There is nothing Argentina can do to change that.
May 06th, 2017 - 08:15 am - Link - Report abuse +2As Marcelo Kohen has already explained in a previous article
http://en.mercopress.com/2004/06/23/international-hague-court-only-alternative-for-dispute
the only way forward for the Republic of Argentina would be to take their “claim” before the fifteen judges at the United Nations International Court of Justice (UNICJ) in the Hague. I wonder why they refuse to do so?*
*Don't worry......I know why ;-D
They would not comply with the decision when it went against them anyway .Beagle channel?
May 06th, 2017 - 03:47 pm - Link - Report abuse +2@Marcelo Kohen
May 08th, 2017 - 10:09 pm - Link - Report abuse +2“No local authority can modify what is established by a bilateral agreement”
The Falkland Island Government is not a council such as Shropshire County Council.
Shropshire County Council cannot make laws, that is up to parliament in London.
The FIG can do what it choses, as it is a democratically elected government, elected by people who were born there or have become Falkland nationals (i.e. not every resident has the right to vote).
Argentina has no say in the government of the Falklands whatsoever.
Bertone claims she is the Falklands Governor.
She hasn't been to the Falklands, she wasn't born there, she was not voted in by Islanders, and she's doing a very bad job, because if as Argentina claims she is the governor, why wasn't she at the Queen's birthday parade? A massive sign of disrespect to her monarch.
With very few exceptions, none of Argentina's nationals were born in the Falkland Islands, and if Argentines have not been elected by Falkland Islanders, they have no say regarding the Islands.
Bilateral agreements between the UK and any other country do not prevent the Falkland Island Government making their own laws or regulations.
In the same way, Falkland Islanders have no say in what happens in the UK.
You can disagree, but that is akin to a deaf man shouting into a force ten gale.
The shouting doesn't stop the gale.
Pete Bog
May 08th, 2017 - 10:49 pm - Link - Report abuse -1Yeah...
Scotland is a Country with it's own Government and Parliament...
...and they can't interfere with UK bilateral agreements...
What part of NSGT don't you understand...?
oice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
May 09th, 2017 - 01:40 am - Link - Report abuse +1“What part of NSGT don't you understand...?
”14.4 TERMINATION OF NON-SELF-GOVERNING STATUS: THE FORMS OF SELF-GOVERNMENT
(1) TERMINATION OF NON-SELF-GOVERNING STATUS: CRITERIA FOR SELF-GOVERNMENT
A territory ceases to be 'non-self-governing' when it has achieved self-government, or rather, in the terms of Article 73, 'full' self-government. The question is which political statuses will be regarded as satisfying this requirement. In view of the omission of the term 'independence' from Article 73,73 it is clear that other possibilities were contemplated, and despite the emphasis in the Colonial Declaration on independence as the primary form of self-government, the Assembly has fairly consistently allowed three alternatives:
A Non-Self-Governing Territory can be said to have reached a full measure of self-government by:
Emergence as a sovereign independent State;
Free association with an independent State; or
Integration with an independent State.74
In general terms therefore, there can be no doubt about what is meant by 'full-self-government'. … The obligations of the Administering State to 'promote the well being of the inhabitants', and the specific obligations in Article 73a and 73c, are certainly capable of this interpretation: nevertheless a majority of the General Assembly has generally taken the view that, while material and political progress is a correlative of political independence, it is not a pre-condition; that the two should be promoted together, and that ultimately political self-determination is the basis of the enjoyment of other rights.”
THE CREATION OF STATES IN INTERNATIONAL LAW by James R. Crawford. judge of the ICJ
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Crawford_(jurist)
erence Hill
May 09th, 2017 - 11:21 am - Link - Report abuse -1”A Non-Self-Governing Territory can be said to have reached a full measure of self-government by:
Emergence as a sovereign independent State;...Hasn't happened...
Free association with an independent State; or
Integration with an independent State.74...That hasn't happened either...
Unless, of course, you have some legislation from the FIG or the UK where this has been proclaimed/implemented...
...thought not, so like I said...NSGT...
Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
May 09th, 2017 - 01:36 pm - Link - Report abuse +1“Free association with an independent State” was exactly what the self-determination of their Referendum achieved. “Do you wish the Falkland Islands to retain their current political status as an Overseas Territory of the United Kingdom” is a legal sufficiency.
Unless you can show where in the Charter or an ICJ el al ruling prohibits such a course of action. An unsupported personal opinion is empty rhetoric devoid of proof.
A legal sufficiency...?
May 09th, 2017 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse -1Define...“Overseas Territory of the United Kingdom”
A territory of the United Kingdom that is overseas...?
A partly governed territory of the United Kingdom...?
A British Territory that is overseas...?
A British Overseas Territory...?
A population of British People partly governed by Britain...?
Can you show me anyone else that supports your view that the referendum achieved Free Association with an Independent State...?
Or is this....An unsupported personal opinion of empty rhetoric devoid of proof...?
psst....we know it is...;-)
Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
May 09th, 2017 - 05:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Can you show me anyone else that supports your view” Yes, James R. Crawford. judge of the ICJ who said. “A territory ceases to be 'non-self-governing' when it has achieved self-government, or rather, in the terms of Article 73, 'full' self-government. … the Assembly has fairly consistently allowed three alternatives:
A Non-Self-Governing Territory can be said to have reached a full measure of self-government by: … In general terms therefore, there can be no doubt about what is meant by 'full-self-government’.”
Incidentally it is not my onus to prove a negative. Unless the conduct you are complaining of is specifically illegal then it is permitted regardless. Since I can clearly show by who’s authority my claim is based on, then it is your burden to prove by who’s counter authority it is otherwise.
So the judge said full self Government...;-)))
May 09th, 2017 - 10:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Now we all know the Falklands don't have full self Government...
So it is only your...unsupported personal opinion of empty rhetoric and devoid of proof.
Thought so...
Yaint fooling anyone Terry me ole son....
Voice, V0ice, Vestige, Think et al, sock-puppeteer extraordinaire
May 09th, 2017 - 11:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Doesn’t matter how much sophistry you engage in, the bottom line is the only opinion that matters legally, is theirs to the exclusion of all others.
Western Sahara, ICJ
“. . . the subsequent development of international law in regard to non-self-governing territories, as enshrined in the Charter of the United Nations, made the principle of self-determination applicable to all of them”
Judge Dillard, in his explanation, adds; “ .. it is for the people to determine the destiny of the territory and not the territory the destiny of the people.”
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