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Lula tells BBC why he was jailed to prevent him from winning the presidential election
Brazil's former president, Lula da Silva, says he was jailed to prevent him from winning the 2018 presidential election which saw far-right candidate Jair Bolsonaro elected. In an exclusive interview with the BBC via letters from his cell, Lula said Judge Sergio Moro “did politics and not justice” when he sentenced him. Read full article
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Disclaimer & comment rulesREF: “Lulla says he was jailed to prevent him from winning the 2018 presidential election”
Dec 08th, 2018 - 09:20 am - Link - Report abuse +3http://www.contraovento.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/lula-crime3.jpg
Did he say that he was jailed because he didn't share a large enough part of his illicit wealth with the other crooks?
”Bolsonaro Jr. Driver Investigated For Financial Irregularities
Dec 08th, 2018 - 10:38 am - Link - Report abuse -3In the COAF statement to the O Estadao de Sao Paolo news outlet on Thursday, the former driver of Flavio Bolsonaro, Fabricio Jose Carlos de Queiroz, is alleged to have moved 1.2 million Reais (around U$D 307,116 on the current exchange rate) between January 2016 and January 2017.
Among the records analyzed, data shows that Michelle Bolsonaro, future first lady of Brazil, received 24,000 Reais (U$D 6,142.32) in a check.
...The investigation also reports different transactions between Fabricio Carlos de Queiroz and his daughter, Natalia Melo de Queiroz, who was, until November, an advisor in the office of the federal deputy and now President-elect Jair Bolsonaro (PSL).
..On Thursday, a demand was filed for the opening of an investigation procedure, in the Attorney General's Office (PGR), to examine possible criminal and administrative offenses involving State Representative Flavio Bolsonaro.
https://www.telesurenglish.net/news/Bolsonaro-Jr.-Driver-Investigated-For-Financial-Irregularities-20181207-0020.html
Lula rots in prison while free-market economists are welcoming Bolsonoaro's policies in favor of foreign corporations and investment as well as the liberation of the Brazilian economy advocating for less government intervention, all the way to privatizing parts of Petrobras. What joyous times for the people of Brazil!
Dec 08th, 2018 - 12:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Chicureo aka “the fascista hustler”
Dec 08th, 2018 - 02:49 pm - Link - Report abuse -3TROLL ALERT
Admirable cattle...
Dec 08th, 2018 - 05:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGdy_kc27zI
imoyaro: Enjoyed the Video, ¡obrigado - gracias!
Dec 08th, 2018 - 06:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“ Lula said that “Bolsonaro only won because he did not run against me”
Dec 08th, 2018 - 08:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0A rather bold statement....which no doubt the “presidiário” can afford to make, as he knows no one will be able to demand he prove it...but it is the 'toad's' opinion.
“I was convicted for being the most successful president of the Republic [of Brazil] and the one who did most for the poor” ............more bs...
The only thing that surprises me is that a BBC reporter actually wasted his time to listen to Lula's lies....there must be a lack of important things happening, as no one except the PT is any longer interested in the 'toad'.
JB
Dec 08th, 2018 - 08:59 pm - Link - Report abuse -2“A rather bold statement.” Not at all, given the following historical record and excluding your fake opinionated drivel.
”He(Bolsonaro) has led the field from the outset in polls that excluded Lula, ...“
https://uk. reuters.com/article/uk-malaysia-politics-rally/jubilant-malays-rally-after-malaysia-refuses-u-n-racial-equality-pledge-idUKKBN1O70AY
”If Lula’s name is excluded, Bolsonaro leads with..“
https://www. reuters.com/article/us-brazil-election-poll/right-winger-bolsonaro-gains-ground-in-brazil-presidential-poll-idUSKCN1L715G
”Lula was running for a third term and leading in the polls until he was barred...
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/10/27/americas/brazil-election/index.html
Donald J. Trump on Twitter: ”The Paris Agreement isn’t working out so well for Paris. Protests and riots all over France. People do not want to pay large sums of money, much to third world countries (that are questionably run), in order to maybe protect the environment. Chanting “We Want Trump!” Love France.”
Dec 08th, 2018 - 09:21 pm - Link - Report abuse +1- - - - - - - -
Lula should play it smart and lay the blame upon Donald Trump. (Just like Clinton accused Russia.) ...it's a much better defense than admitting he's currently incarcerated because he's a proven convicted thieving criminal...
Thousands of protesters were on the Champs-Élysées today voicing their displeasure against Macron who recently lectured President Trump about not supporting Globalism. According to Angela Merkel, Trump is responsible for the partial destruction of the New World Order, with populist right-leaning leaders winning elections in Brazil, Poland, Austria, Hungary and Italy the past year.
Meanwhile, protests are happening today in Belgium and Holland as well.
TH
Dec 08th, 2018 - 09:41 pm - Link - Report abuse -2you can take all your manipulated polls and shove them up your xxxx, fact is that once it started to sink in to the heads of the more ignorant - which make up most of Lula's disenchanted followers - that he was in jail because he's a stinking crook, they realized he wan't worth his weight in sh*t. You can believe those polls if you want, but the fact that the manipulated figures did not work in Haddad's favor, just shows that your clay-footed idol would not have won.
Rant 'n rave all you want, won't change the facts....dimwit.
Chicureo aka “the fascista hustler”
Dec 08th, 2018 - 09:42 pm - Link - Report abuse -2“The Paris Agreement isn’t working out so well for Paris” It has nothing to do with PG and everything to do with a cash grab by the government.
Whereas, the Chicago boys polices have resulted in your forests heading for extinction, half country is now desert. Your fishing stocks with exception of sardines are being rapidly depleted, and basic necessities like clean air and water are woefully absent in your capital city.
There is not one first world government that shares your view of Lula's conviction. Since it is viewed as travesty of justice. Since he would never have been convicted under the alleged evidence in any civilised nation. In fact, the UNHRC as already said his treatment was contrary to the international protocol of human rights. So he is viewed internationally as a political prisoner.
Of course, Lula was interviewed and he had to tell BBC what he believes to be true.
Dec 08th, 2018 - 09:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0However, for anybody able to add 2 plus 2, the reality blatantly emerges.
A few months ago, Lula was successfully campaigning across Brazil, receiving huge accolades from the public, and opinion polls showed him at the top of vote intentions. Bolsonaro was trailing way behind.
“Prior to being barred, Lula led all scenarios in polls for the October election, achieving 39 percent in voter intentions within one month of the first round,” notes Wikipedia.
Let's remember that Lula left power with “astonishing approval ratings of close to 90%” as stated by The Guardian in a Dec. 31, 2010 story.
The reason being, Lula was rightly credited with lifting over 20 million people out of poverty -- in one of the more unequal Latin American countries. ”The percentage of Brazilians belonging to the consumerist middle class (rose) from 37% to 50% of the population,” also according to Wikipedia.
What were the powers that be going to do? The only resource at hand was to take Lula out of the game. Military coups being out of favour, judge Moro came to play with his famous verdict -- based on the judge's conviction rather than hard proof -- that Lula had accepted a refurbished apartment as a bribe.
Strategically timed, the sentence and subsequent imprisonment of Lula gave the PT little time to change candidate, and as expected one leader cannot automatically transfer his vote intentions to somebody else.
And so, with this key intervention from the judiciary and strongly biased media support, Jair Bolsonaro became president -- as simple as that.
Showing how little he cares about public perception, Bolsonaro did not hesitate to generously reward judge Moro for his services.
In spite of this all, Brazil will come out of this.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/dec/31/brazil-lula-era-ends
JB
Dec 08th, 2018 - 10:49 pm - Link - Report abuse -2“you can take all your manipulated polls” Aha your proof less opinion which means it has no weight, against two Reuters articles and CNN, based on their unbiased polls. So I don't have to change the facts, when the evidence shows clearly your only one trying to take end runs around them.
Enrique Massot
Dec 08th, 2018 - 11:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Thank you for my evening entertainment. I enjoyed reading the Guardian article. (The photograph of Lula cheek to cheek with Dilma was so sentimental...) Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva's toxic popular personality cult reminds me a lot of Hugo Chávez, Daniel Ortega, Cristina Fernández de Kirchner and Fidel Castro.
I sincerely agree with you that Lula believes his chance of being elected president was stolen. However, for anybody able to add 2 plus 2, the reality blatantly emerges that the Brazilian Supreme Court upheld its democratic constitution legally eliminated Lula's candidacy.
According to your opinion, if indeed Lula was responsible for “lifting over 20 million people out of poverty” then why is it now that according to the IBGE “Brazil ...suffered its worst-ever recession between 2014 and 2016?” Are Dilma and Temer responsible for this disaster? High unemployment with poverty reaching 54.8 million people, Petrobras in bankruptcy and municipalities unable to fund basic services?
Reminds me of a similar story about Hillary Clinton who was also successfully campaigning across The USA, receiving huge accolades from the public, and opinion polls showed her as well being at the top of vote intentions. Trump was trailing way behind...
Then Bolsonaro was elected... oh my... What were the Globalist powers going to do? The only response was to accuse the freely elected president a Fascist intent on returning the country to a Nationalist military dictatorship.
(Speaking of being recognized as the legitimate future president of Brazil, did you notice all the world leaders friendly greet Bolsinaro at the G-20?)
Anyway, for YOUR entertainment, I submit a short video by a British narrator of what's happening regarding Globalists being confronted by Nationalists. Enjoy!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?ebc=ANyPxKrpTT4rI-hHFn8vHxiTqOLGCFG5cg9KwS5_MHyxZrqBAERM7jwr0pXMbUGy6-2XPjDbc7IIo6-kQChLIXRNEKq1h41-rA&time_continue=531&v=LCwWpENkIwA
@Chicureo
Dec 09th, 2018 - 09:02 am - Link - Report abuse -1REF: “What joyous times for the people of Brazil”:
What joyous times for the POLITICIANS of Brazil!
http://jotaneves.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2011/05/Eleicao.jpg
The ignorant demigodism of Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva is thankfully over.
Dec 09th, 2018 - 04:54 pm - Link - Report abuse -1It's not only Brazil that's rejecting the Socialist Globalist agenda and instead embracing the ever more popular Nationalist movements instead. Lula was/is adored and worshipped by the new age SJW snowflakes worldwide, but the Brazilian people woke up to a plundered national economy with high unemployment and crime. The conservative Populism of Bolsonaro resonated with the common people. Thankfully, the Brazilian judicial system followed its Democratic Constitution and imprisoned the bastard.
Today the little people in France, Belgium and Holland have blindsided the Globalist elites. The peasants have been commanded to pay one more tax to fuel their mobility and a lot of pent up frustration has been unleashed. They are mad as Hell and they are not going to take any more of it. The interconnectivity of the social media has been like oxygen to fuel the rage.
Clearly, the radical anti-carbon elites believe that little people are just dying to be taxed more and more in order to transition to Utopia. Well, peasant riots spread when the peasants have had enough. The bureaucratic complexity required to establish and maintain a carbon natural Utopia is enormous. The elites revel in it and worship it. The little people get bitten in the ass by it.
Bolsonaro is following a Nationalist credo of what is best for the Brazilian people. His enemies almost killed him and perhaps that will only be the way that they will in the future stop him from succeeding.
¡Ordem e Progresso!
@EM
Dec 09th, 2018 - 06:32 pm - Link - Report abuse -1“Of course, Lula was interviewed and he had to tell BBC what he believes to be true”
“What 'he believes to be true ?” Noooo......what he want's his stupid followers to believe....and looks like you do.
“However, for anybody able to add 2 plus 2, the reality blatantly emerges.”
Exactly...and looks like you can't.
Reekie, why waste your time repeating the same lies over and over again ? who do you think you'll convince ? Terry the idiot ? Don't worry, he already believes Lula is the most honest man that ever walked on the face of the Earth, and that everyone considers him a political prisoner.
@Chicureo
EM and TH just don't understand the facts, but I'm sure that if they tried to visit Lula in Curitiba, the judge might allow them an intimate moment with the fingerless toad.
Chicureo aka “the fascista hustler”
Dec 09th, 2018 - 07:30 pm - Link - Report abuse -1“Socialist Globalist agenda..” All of Lula's legislative agenda was largely nationalist. In an attempt to be inclusive of all of Brazil's citizenry. Not to exclude those that are unable to afford to be represented at the political table. This was basically the same promotion that the champion of conservatism Benjamin Disrael gave with his 'noblesse oblige entreaty.
“To a plundered national economy...” is simply your reactionary slant. As there is no economist that stated there was any other reason than the commodities market crash.
Terry
Dec 09th, 2018 - 08:51 pm - Link - Report abuse -1Didn't you read what Emmanuel Macron explained to the world that “Nationalism is a betrayal of patriotism”...are you implying that Lula da Silva is unpatriotic?
Globalists consider both Lula and Dilma as one of their elite ideology, certainly his commitment to solidifying the “BRICKS” economic block was a perfect example of Globalism. Lula is a Marxist leaning populist Globalist. (You probably confusing the definition of a populist vs. a Nationalist.)
Also, I think its a bit pretentious of you to compare Lula with the great Benjamin Disrael who was most certainly not a convicted criminal, don't you think?
Speaking of a failed national economy, its just a undeniable fact when you examine how the country was repeatedly raped and plundered during the Brazilian governmental administration controlled by the Partido dos Trabalhadores. It was definitely not because of low commodity and petroleum prices.
Did Lula personally steal from the pockets of the poor? No, not very much, but the political party he controlled through his surrogates most certainly did to the point of nearly bankrupting the national treasury and brought misery to the poverty stricken.
The Brazilian leftist political elite are experiencing what it was like in Pompeii when the lava fell from the sky and the Globalist political elites couldn’t separate themselves from their slaves in the commonality as Bolsonaro's Nationalist agenda is soon ready to ominously fall upon them.
Thankfully, the ignorant demigodism of Luiz Inácio Lula da Silva is thankfully over.
JB
Dec 09th, 2018 - 11:27 pm - Link - Report abuse -1“ Lula said that “Bolsonaro only won because he did not run against me...no one will be able to demand he prove it...but it is the 'toad's' opinion. ..TH just don't understand the facts“ What an absolute oxymoron since that is what anything I post is based on. Whereas, your's is based on your not so humble, and totally dishonest opinion as shown in the following.
”Lula was running for a third term and leading in the polls until he was barred... “
http://en.mercopress.com/2018/12/08/lula-tells-bbc-why-he-was-jailed-to-prevent-him-from-winning-the-presidential-election/comments#comment495506
Chicureo aka “the fascista hustler”
”Globalists consider both Lula and Dilma..“ Aha, the paranoia of loony right. You've replaced ”reds under the beds“. A quick search shows the only sources for such material is the alt right and the religious right with their global chant of 'Trump' as in Paris. Go on amaze me, with a bona fide original source of 'Globalism'. ”Paranoia strikes deep into your life it will creep.“
”to compare Lula with the great Benjamin Disrael who was most certainly not a convicted criminal” Neither, is Lula by any genuine legal standard, Brazil cannot even meet the criteria of the minimum standards of human rights as the UNHRC has already stated numerous times.
The mendacious idiot Terry is a Mercopress comments section treasure; everything he/she says is a wonder of stupidity, ignorance as well as vacuousness and best of all, cluelessness. He/she really does think so highly of himself/herself that he doesn't bother to stop a bit and learn something about the topics he/she discusses. We are all luckier for his/her comic entertaining existence here and I wouldn't have it any other way. Plus, it's not nice to make fun of the mentally challenged.
Dec 10th, 2018 - 01:12 am - Link - Report abuse -1Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 10th, 2018 - 02:16 am - Link - Report abuse -1”The mendacious ..Terry“ So you opine like all you reactionaries who all share the same MO. Total opinion devoid of any proven facts, for filling the old maxim about 'empty vessels make the most sound'
”Globalists consider...“ You alt right followers have hi-jacked a trading condition to:
”The term “globalist” has been used a pejorative for political enemies who are perceived as too “cosmopolitan” or favoring international projects over national ones. For example, during the election and presidency of United States president Donald Trump, Trump and members of his administration used the term globalist on multiple occasions. Critics claimed that the administration used the term as an anti-Semitic “dog whistle” term referring to members of a Jewish conspiracy
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Globalism
Terry
Dec 10th, 2018 - 03:04 am - Link - Report abuse -1You obviously are an ignorant fool. Trump's daughter, son-in-law and 3 grandchildren are Orthodox Jews. At least 5 top WH positions are held by Jews. He's the most pro-Israel president in history.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 10th, 2018 - 08:48 am - Link - Report abuse -2”You obviously...” Not at all I'm well acquainted with that fact. It just goes to show how bizarre is the muddled thinking of the alt right from which they draw their support.
You claim that the American President is an anti-Semite, yet I've already pointed out to you that Trump's daughter, son-in-law and 3 grandchildren are Orthodox Jews. At least 5 high rankling WH positions are held by Jews as well. Why is it Benjamin Netanyahu, the Prime Minister of Israel, described Donald Trump as a “close personal friend” and the most pro-Israeli President in history?
Dec 10th, 2018 - 12:52 pm - Link - Report abuse +1Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 10th, 2018 - 01:10 pm - Link - Report abuse -1”You claim“ No I don't I'm just the messenger relaying what the media has discovered. No surprise the man is a fruit cake.
”Globalist political elites..“ ”Donald Trump keeps calling adversaries “globalists,” despite warnings it's anti-Semitic“
https://www.newsweek. com/donald-trump-anti-semitic-globalist-koch-1052375
While you obviously are not aware of Trump's history and beliefs.
”Trump's grandfather was a pimp and tax evader; his father a member of the KKK
As they say, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree; Donald Trump's racism can easily be traced through his lineage.”
http://ahtribune. com/us/2016-election/242-trump-grandfather-pimp-father-kkk.html
“PBS and The Huffington Post have uncovered video evidence of Donald Trump’s long-held beliefs that he (and people like him) are genetically superior:
https://www.new
Video evidence truly exposing just how anti-Semitic Terry somehow thinks the USA President. https://www.whitehouse.gov/1600daily/
Dec 10th, 2018 - 04:15 pm - Link - Report abuse 0By the way, the African-American approval rate of the presidency is the highest in over 40 years. So much for accusing him being a racist as well.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 10th, 2018 - 04:42 pm - Link - Report abuse -1”Terry somehow thinks...So much for accusing him ” No I don't I'm just the messenger showing what the media has discovered. He is not a person who is even interesting. No surprise the man is a fruit cake.
“PBS and The Huffington Post have uncovered video evidence of Donald Trump’s long-held beliefs that he (and people like him) are genetically superior:
http://www.dailykos.com/story/2016/9/29/1575870/-Shocking-video-of-Trump-explaining-his-dangerous-theory-that-people-like-him-have-superior-genes
“By the way,..” No proof, no truth.
Close personal friend of Lula da Silva in the news: https://www1.folha.uol.com.br/internacional/en/brazil/2018/12/twelve-women-accuse-medium-john-of-god-of-sexual-abuse.shtml
Dec 10th, 2018 - 05:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Maybe they will be future prison cell mates...
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 10th, 2018 - 05:45 pm - Link - Report abuse -1When you've lost the argument change the subject, so thanks for the confirmation.
”Close personal friend of Lula da Silva in the news” No proof, no truth.
Would suspect that if this person had any political affinity its more likely to be with the religious right.
Bolsonaro has just put such a women in his cabinet.
@TH
Dec 10th, 2018 - 06:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0”Lula was running for a third term and leading in the polls until he was barred... “
Lula ignored many in his party who didn't want him to run, as they, as well as the toad, knew very well that his candidacy would never be accepted by the TRE. But he insisted until the last minute, his ego was too big to back down and admit the obvious.
In fact, his situation suited him down to a tee - he knew he'd be jailed, so he campaigned - until he was forced to vacate his SBC flat, to a somewhat more modest abode in Curitiba - taking advantage to criticize everything and everyone, knowing well he'd never be held to any of his promises....His strategy was to play the victim, and if Haddad had won, it would be a moral victory for Lula, but if he lost, it would be entirely Haddad's fault. Typical of the toad...always someone else's fault. Much like you, blaming journalists for poor translations.
Just fyi, a new case - yet another, the 8th ? - is now being built against Lula, AND his son, Luis Fabio....from crap cleaner in the zoo, to successful business man, who in 9 months multiplied his company's worth by 770%......and without even having closed any deals...other than acting as front man for his 'daddy'.....soon he'll be keeping 'papá' company in Curitiba. Can't wait to see the whole Silva clan behind bars.
You imply that the newly nominated cabinet member is just like the sexual pervert that's Lula's close criminal friend? I always knew Lula was a common thief.
Dec 10th, 2018 - 06:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0JB
Dec 10th, 2018 - 07:02 pm - Link - Report abuse -1The only one ignoring anything is you since your pretence was shown to be bogus like everything else you claim.
“he knows no one will be able to demand he prove it. ..A rather bold statement.” Not at all, given the following historical record and excluding your fake opinionated drivel.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll”
“I always knew..” You've admirably shown you don't know your annus from a hole in the ground.
@Chicureo
Dec 11th, 2018 - 02:06 am - Link - Report abuse 0Since the other comments have closed: we're in Torres del Paine but sadly we only had time for 1 full day in Chile. We drove over the border from Argentina yesterday, and did a short walk just to a view point. Today we went up to the Torres Base but unfortunately it was too cloudy to see anything and it also rained miserably all afternoon. Still, it was a nice walk through the forest and not nearly as bad as the time we went up Ben Nevis in April. The climate in Patagonia is really oversold, so far it's just like England in summer but with more wind. I wish I hadn't bothered bringing so many warm clothes, haven't needed them at all.
@TH
Dec 11th, 2018 - 03:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0If my opinion “he knows no one will be able to demand he prove it.”, referring to the 'toad's' campaign bs, in your opinion is a bogus claim, prove I'm wrong.....I maintain that he knew damned well he'd never have to deliver....it was just his way of crapping on the opposition and the Temer administration, trying to make the PT look not so bad.
While I'm enjoying making you look like a fool, I thought it might be worthwhile wasting a few more seconds on you, and comment on yet more of your bs...
Refer to “Bolsonaro recommends prudence...”, already closed.
“Terence Hill
JB
” “nobody saw it coming”, 'another lie'.... So you claim, funny how your unable to ever provide evidence.”
Really Terry ? Me, provide evidence ???
So, in your ‘expert’ opinion, out of 200 million Brazilians - and countless people from other countries, obviously not as dumb as you - “nobody saw it coming” (referring to the 2014/16 crisis).
Since YOU stated “Nobody saw it coming”, as if were FACT, it’s up to you to prove it when challenged, numb nuts…or of course, you can accuse me of “moving the goalposts”....(one of your favorite 'wiggles'..).
Ah, and just fyi, beginning 2014, 10 months before Dilma the “anta” was re-elected, day-to-day reality was already contradicting government indices….such as energy bills, food 'n fuel prices, inflation etc, which you of course, would not have felt because you never lived here....... There, I’ve given you an excuse to try to wiggle out of yet another gaffe. Or you can allege it was the author’s fault for misleading you….poor Terry, always getting the wrong end of the stick.
@DT
Sounds like you're having a good time, despite the weather.......presume you've been drinking wine everyday, and intend to continue.....may I suggest you ask for the “1865” carmenère from the 'San Pedro' winery. V. good cost /benefit.
JB
Dec 11th, 2018 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse -1“he knows no one will be able to demand he prove it.” Oho, that darned evidence proving yet again you are a liar.
”Lula was running for a third term and leading in the polls until he was barred...
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/10/27/americas/brazil-election/index.html
Funny how you can't produce one politician or economist that sounded a cautionary note, in spite of your claim of “out of 200 million Brazilians - and countless people from other countries,” Just one more of your zillions of fibs.
@TH
Dec 11th, 2018 - 06:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your “nobody saw it coming” is pure, unadulterated bs.. .above, I claim many people did see the crisis coming, and well before Dilma was re-elected.
To back-up my opinion, based on the fact I was here - and you were not - and could see the sh*t, slowly but surely, hitting the fan, you can google the below three articles :
Presume you can google translate them due to your zero compehension of Portuguese...
1) As Reais Causas da Crise Econômica no Brasil.
Points out the recession's real causes : lack of infrastructure (despite 2 PAC's and USD 1 trilllion later) ; lack of decent education policies ; no long term planning - just late reactions to events ; lack of goverment credibility - domestic and internationally ; unbridled corruption; incompetence.
The end of the 'boom' was simply a signal that the 'easy' days were over, no more abundant revenue to cover up the PT sh*t, and their mistakes, which were frequent, making the bad, worse.
2) Crise Econômica no Brasil - Juliana Bezzerra
beginning 2014, months before Dilma's re-election, the Country was already in 'technical' recession....negative results in 2 consecutive quarters.....“...com essas medidas o país entrou em recessão técnica em meados de 2014, , com queda da produção industrial, dos salários reais, e do PIB em 3.8% em 2015”.
3) Crise Econômica no Brasil desde 2014 - Wikipedia.
Just a summary of all the above, making it clear that the foundations for the crisis were laid, well before 2014, when it actually 'exploded', because Dilma could no longer hide the sh*t.
To think that no one noticed it, or to claim “no one did” - as you do - is to underestimate people's intelligence and a clear sign of stupidity....your specialty.
JB
Dec 11th, 2018 - 07:35 pm - Link - Report abuse -2”nobody saw it coming” Thanks for confirmation that you are unable to provide testimony of any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market.
@JB
Dec 12th, 2018 - 02:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0Yeah, it's been amazing. Wish I didn't have to go home, or I could take the mountains with me. And just driving for miles on empty roads without eleventy million people in the way all the time. I hate how crowded England is. We even got to stay in our own tiny Patagonian shack, ridiculously over heated even after asking them to turn the boiler down.
And we have been drinking wine most evenings, but only white. That's still a big win though, because before we came my partner didn't like any wine at all. Turns out dessert wine was were the gateway drug, even if it was really embarrassing to order.
Tomorrow we fly back to BA and then miserable wintery London the day after. I wanted to stay for my birthday so I could celebrate it in summer for once, but it was too expensive.
TerrenceHill
Dec 12th, 2018 - 03:12 am - Link - Report abuse 0I hoped your visit to Chile, were you in Patagonia? Did you visit Santiago?
Safe travels home my friend. I sincerely hope you had a wonderful time.
@TH
Dec 12th, 2018 - 07:36 pm - Link - Report abuse -1Your above post on “nobody saw it coming”, proves one of two things, or both...
1) you don't understand Portuguese
2) you are inacapable of translating the articles via Google - which if you knew how to, you probably wouldn't understand what was written, as Economics is not your strong poit...only stupidity and stubborness are..
The population's testimony is better than any half-baked opinion of your's....dimwit.
Amazing, even after proof is rubbed in your ugly mug, you refuse to accept it. Like a true 'petista'
Ah, btw, did you know that Lula is rotting in jail ? why don't you visit him, I heard he is asking for intimate visits....
JB
Dec 12th, 2018 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse -2“Your above...”
So there isn't any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market, thanks for the confirmation pillock.
Here's an article (in English for bozos) talking about Brazil's economic problems back in 2013:
Dec 12th, 2018 - 10:53 pm - Link - Report abuse 0https://www.economist.com/the-americas/2013/12/07/the-deterioration
Chicureo, was that supposed to be addressed to me? Don't think Terry has ever been in Chile.
DT
Dec 13th, 2018 - 12:19 am - Link - Report abuse -2What the Economist article doesn't mention is the root cause, so for those pillocks that don't understand what was happening in the commodities market. Which was unexpected and caught everyone flat-footed.
”The price of gold bullion fell dramatically on 12 April 2013 and analysts frantically sought explanations. Rumors spread that the European Central Bank (ECB) would force Cyprus to sell its gold reserves in response to its financial crisis. Major banks such as Goldman Sachs began immediately to short gold bullion. Investors scrambled to liquidate their exchange-traded funds (ETFs)[notes 3] and margin call selling accelerated. George Gero, precious metals commodities expert at the Royal Bank of Canada (RBC) Wealth Management section reported that he had not seen selling of gold bullion as panicked as this in his forty years in commodity markets”
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodity_market
What has the price of gold bullion got to do with anything? Just another distraction from you.
Dec 13th, 2018 - 02:24 am - Link - Report abuse 0DT
Dec 13th, 2018 - 02:41 am - Link - Report abuse 0What has the price of gold bullion got to do with anything.” Everything.
The runoff of gold which is a major component of commodities market, and precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market in 2014. But, only pillocks wouldn't know that, look it up.
@DT
Dec 13th, 2018 - 06:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Back in the UK ?
What Terry the idiot can't understand, is that while the commodity market was heated, it brought in tons of easy revenue to Brazil, and when the prices started to decline, already in 2010, Lula 'n Dilma took no measures to curb spending (and while corruption was on the rise). That is the root cause of today's crisis in Brazil, plain incompetence.
There's a lot of info available, simply too much to consider posting, 'n not all that easy to find, but according to an IPEA study (dept within Min of Planning) in 2011, between 2007 and 2010 (Lula's 2nd term) the participation of commodities in Brazil's total exports rose from 41 to 51% ....creating an excessive 'n dangerous dependence on exports over which there is little control.
Btwn 2008 'n 2009, total Brazilian exports decreased from US$ 191 billion, to 152 billion, or a 21% reduction. Did that raise any red flags withing the government ? No.
According to the Commodities Research Bureau (CRB), commodity prices dropped (also) 21%, between 2010 and July 2015, so through a combination of all the above trends, it was fairly easy to see that the economic situation was deteriorating well before the crisis exploded. It only didn't explode in 2013 because Dilma was camouflaging it's effects (and the growing deficit) through the illegal loans from State banks (which led to her impeachment).
The PT administrations just sat back, relying on a decreasing source of revenue, relegating ind'l production to 2nd plan....setting the stage for recession ('n loss of jobs), but seems the only ones caught “flat-footed”, or that “didn't see it coming” were the PT economists and Terry the scumbag.
The scumbag's reference to the price of gold bullion had nothing to do with the PT's incompetence ; now that the scumbag can see he has lost the battle on the ”commodities'' front, the gold bullion crap is his attempt at distraction He should put his diapers back on....
JB
Dec 13th, 2018 - 07:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“but seems the only ones caught “flat-footed” plus you. ”has lost the battle on the ”commodities'' front,” Hardly, and beside the worst drop in gold prices in forty years in 2013; the following year there was a huge drop in commodities en total. You are still unable to provide any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market. After three times of asking you, thanks for the confirmation there aren't any, plonker.
Numbnuts,
Dec 13th, 2018 - 07:59 pm - Link - Report abuse 0the IPEA is crammed with economists who work for the Ministry of Planning......but of course, in your expert opinion they are not qualified to issue an opinion on the recession.....what do they know of Brazil ? What does Charlie Hitchens, have to say about it ?
One last thing. Haddad went to visit Lula last week, and on his way out, he told reporters that Lula is pining away, but that he is still expecting your visit.....and he promised to dim the lights so you don't get embarrassed when he cuddles up behind you......
NN, there was a time your gaffes were entertaining......now, they are pathetic and boring.
JB
Dec 13th, 2018 - 08:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Blah, blah, blah.
You are still unable to provide any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market. After three times of asking you, thanks for the confirmation there aren't any, plonker.
@JB
Dec 14th, 2018 - 03:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I am now. Got back this morning. Did you have a big thunderstorm in SP yesterday? We flew around the city, I think we went over a place called Mogi das Cruzes, and the pilot was obviously trying to avoid the massive storm clouds. I was probably within a few tens of miles of you.
@Terry
As usual you're an idiot. Every boom is followed by a bust, the question is not if but when. Try some of these articles that talk about the problems with Brazil's dependence on commodities:
https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2012/04/the-next-global-crash-why-you-should-fear-the-commodities-bubble/255901/
www.americasquarterly.org/kingstone
www.foreignaffairs.com/articles/brazil/2012-04-24/bearish-brazil
business.financialpost.com/news/brazil-faces-new-oil-boom-curse-as-the-worlds-resource-engine
“Still, commodity price swings can be volatile, making resource-rich economies vulnerable, and efforts devoted to commodities can stifle growth elsewhere. Most productivity growth in a developing economy comes from manufacturing, not agriculture or resource extraction”
@DT
Dec 14th, 2018 - 04:23 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It rained hard in some places in SP yesterday, here is was longer than heavier. Mogi is about 40 kms to the east of the city of SP (within the Metropolitan area), and rains there quite a bit, being beside the mountain range before going down the hill to the coast......and is the route used by planes coming into SP when coming in from over the sea.
Terry has lost it. He refuses to accept the obvious, but that is a trait of the stupid and nothing can change it. His statement that “no elected politician, or major economist foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market” is so damned ignorant, it doesn't even deserve a reply.
No surprise really, as this discussion started when he alleged that “nobody saw it coming”, referring to the recession that exploded in 2014......when that line of arguing went down the drain, he said it was linked to the commodities, and that no one could foresee the prices could fall.....well, any one, with even only half-a-brain (am being generous with Terry) knows that the commodities market is a roller-coaster....and when prices start to fall, they tend to carry on falling for quite a while.
But of course, even with everything around us falling apart at the seams, Terry belives that no one who lives in Brazil, could have seen the sh*t was going to hit the fan one year before it did.....he, in his cocoon probably didn't, but that is a whole different story.
DT
Dec 14th, 2018 - 04:34 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“you're an idiot. Every boom is followed by a bust” Don't tell your granny how to suck eggs.
I'm and idiot? Even though you stated ”What has the price of gold bullion got to do with anything.” Not knowing that the runoff of gold was a major component of commodities market, and precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market.
Thats alright we all know that JB is your cuddle toy, and no matter how much he lies, anybody who challenges him is in the wrong.
Its still on table unanswered. Is there any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw the possibility of a downturn in the commodities market. For all of JB's spouting of his knowledge of Brazil, he cannot find such a person(s).
@JB
Dec 14th, 2018 - 05:58 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I couldn't see much of the city because of the clouds, only that it was very big. It's nice they give you an interactive map now so you can see where you are, and because of the storms we flew off the coast for a while before turning inland at SP, and that made it easier to recognise features. Brazil looks really cool from the air; even though I don't think we went anywhere near the Amazon I saw lots of forest and mountains, and rivers splitting into a million branches. We also flew over a bizarre looking, perfectly straight and even mountain range. It might have been this one:
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@-10.8930148,-44.1272864,12106a,35y,37.77t/data=!3m1!1e3!5m1!1e4
The sun was getting low as we were nearing the Atlantic and I could see it glinting all across the landscape, reflected in many small lakes or rivers. Then we went out over the sea and said goodbye to South America.
I'd like to visit Brazil next, but the amount of crime puts me off, and the country is so huge it seems it would be impossible to really see much of it. Have you even been to Patagonia?
@TH
“I'm and idiot?”
The fact you can't get through a simple three word sentence without making a typo speaks for itself. Are Ruchir Sharma, Chief Global Strategist and head of the Emerging Markets Equity team at Morgan Stanley Investment Management, and Professor Peter Kingstone not expert enough for you? They saw it coming, and if the politicians didn't listen to them, they clearly should have.
You also haven't posted a single link backing up your claim that the fall in the price of gold caused the end of the commodities boom, are you just bullshitting as usual?
DT
Dec 14th, 2018 - 06:14 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Morgan Stanley...” are not in Brazil, which was the question. For any financial question you can find experts all world with conflicting views. That was not what was asked.
“You also haven't posted a single link backing up your claim that the fall in the price of gold caused...”
You also haven't posted a single link backing up your claim that the fall in the price of gold caused an improvement in the commodities market.
“are you just bullshitting as usual?” If bullshit could float...you'd be the Admiral of the fleet.
“You also haven't posted a single link backing up your claim that the fall in the price of gold caused an improvement in the commodities market.”
Dec 14th, 2018 - 10:55 pm - Link - Report abuse 0That's because I'm not claiming any such thing, idiot. I'm asking you to back up your claim, and as usual Terry the arch hypocrite is trying to shift the burden of proof.
@JB
Re your post on “Lula, Dilma and several ministers...”
Yeah, it's obvious deforestation and looking after the environment have never been a priority for Brazil, under any government. Seems things started to go downhill again under Dilma and worsened under Temer. The Guardian expects them to worsen further under B, and I agree with them, but although they may be friendlier to a left-wing government, they didn't hide the problems under Dilma. I agree the amnesty is likely to make things worse, why would anyone bother obeying the law if they can get away with flouting it?
“one or two veiled threats from 'individuals', whose opinions do not reflect Bs official policy”
And aren't those same individuals going to be in the government very soon? That's not exactly reassuring when they think their own opinion should overrule the law.
“You don't ned to “teach” it's “OK” to be gay, instead, teach 'tolerance'.”
What's the difference?
“seems you to tend to agree that not all were cut out to study”
Yes, and I think our government is being foolish trying to push so many kids into an academic path. Churning out more graduates doesn't automatically create more graduate jobs, and the UK now has a shortage of skilled tradesmen. Plus I for sure don't believe kids are born as blank slates. You should develop the talents people have, not push them into something they are bad at. But I think the situation is different in Brazil; with a much lower percentage of graduates, increasing the number might well be good for the economy. Quotas are a short cut to increasing social mobility, but like you say the real solution should be improving basic education.
DT
Dec 15th, 2018 - 01:31 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“The price of gold bullion fell dramatically on 12 April 2013 and analysts frantically sought explanations.”
DT “What has the price of gold bullion got to do with anything.”
TH “gold which is a major component of commodities market, and precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market in 2014
DT ”the price of gold caused the end of the commodities boom“
My claim was ”it precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market“
It was apparently the first of the commodities to fall. Like dominoes down they went. As to certainty of cause and effect thats open to speculation, with no absolute certainty. What is indisputable is gold is a commodity and preceded the rest of the commodities crash. So that is an enlarged answer to ”What has the price of gold.”
Actually, I don't understand what the argument is all about; because after all, those who blew horns, danced on the streets & enjoyed pyrotechnics at the election results; were the SAME masses who blew horns, danced on the streets + enjoyed the pyrotechnics 20 years ago when PT grabbed power! So what's the difference?
Dec 15th, 2018 - 01:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“'Morgan Stanley...' are not in Brazil”
Dec 15th, 2018 - 04:20 pm - Link - Report abuse 0So what? You're not in Brazil and yet you think your opinions should have more weight than Jack's, who is. And you certainly don't rule out the opinions of other experts just because they don't live in the country concerned. You can be sure Morgan Stanley invest in Brazil, so they want to know what what will happen. Yes experts disagree, but I have shown some who predicted the end of the commodities boom, something you claimed no one foresaw.
”it precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market“
“As to certainty of cause and effect thats open to speculation, with no absolute certainty.”
Sounds like you are saying your original claim was just speculation, and you can't find any evidence for it. I have certainly never heard the fall in the price of gold precipitated a general fall in commodity prices, rather it was the slowdown in China that reduced demand.
@:o))
Democracy is the worst system of government, except for all the others we've tried.
DT
Dec 15th, 2018 - 08:28 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“You're not in Brazil” You have absolutely no idea where I'm living. Just another of your wild guesses like “What has the price of gold bullion got to do with anything.” When it is part of the commodities market. “You think your opinions should have more weight..”
Not at all I understand that's just what they are. So after reading and analysing what the major economists given their expert take on the matter. I find them to be a tad more reliable than what an admitted fascist's take is.
“Sounds like you are saying...” No what I've shown is the first major downturn in commodities market was gold.
In the past I have shown numerous economists take on the commodities crash, and vast majority said do nothing it will correct itself.
While JB has relied on the fruits of his wisdom, not bad for a shipping clerk.
@DT
Dec 15th, 2018 - 09:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0From the air, SP is impressive; the forests u saw are what's left of the ‘mata atlantica’, which lined the coast, from RS to RN. The Amazon is about 2,000 kms NNW of SP. Never been to ARG or CHI's Patagonia, the furthest south I went was to my uncle’s farm, 500 kms SW of B.Aires.
The difference btwn teaching 'ok to be gay', 'n 'tolerance' is enormous. The 1st encourages it, the 2nd, others how to accept it.
Just a quickie, unfortunately abt idiot TH : while referring to Brazil's 2014 recession in his reply to Chicureo (see “Bolsonaro recommends prudence..”), he triumphantly stated “there is no economist that stated any other reason than the Commodities mkt crash”, as the cause, followed by “nobody saw it coming”...he crapped himself.
The facts are : 1) NO economist ever stated the recession WAS due to the commodity crash, because it wasn't ; the crash occurred years earlier had no 'direct' link to the recession, and 2) everyone did indeed see the recession coming....the fact PT denied it, tried to cover it up, doesn’t mean people couldn’t see it…and it doesn’t take an economist to recognize the symptoms.
After these 2 lies, both easily unmasked, he resorted to the gold bullion theory…. “that” was the cause of the commodity crash, and of course, the 2014 recession, which “nobody could see coming” .....As if the price of gold had anything to do with the price of soy beans, sugar, coffee, cotton, FOJ, iron ore, oil or aluminum.
His ignorance becomes obvious once again, when he posts abv “ 'Morgan Stanley' are not in Brazil, which was the question. For any financial question you can find experts all world with conflicting views.”
Well, Morgan Stanley IS in Brazil....investment bankers (very well-informed on market trends and the economy)...it's HQ is located in São Paulo. In case the idiot wants proof, their phone is 3048-6000.
Rgdng his 2nd statement, re ''experts with conflicting views”, he chooses to believe only what his left-wing experts say..
JB
Dec 15th, 2018 - 10:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“NO economist ever stated the recession WAS due to the commodity crash, because it wasn't ” So you opine but thats not what those that were unbiased had to say. Which is directly refuted from the following bank's economic report. “After these 2 lies,..” No proof no truth. Blab, blab “Morgan Stanley” You were asked three times to provide any elected politician, or major economist that foresaw ...“ You couldn't so you try faking it.
”What is driving Brazil’s economic downturn?
The downturn of the non-energy commodity
price cycle revealed the underlying structural weaknesses in the Brazilian economy.
Moreover, imbalances rose amid expansionary policies and strong capital inflows.
The shift in global financial market sentiment amid the US Federal reserve’s announcement that it would wind down asset purchases (the “taper tantrum”) in may 2013 had a significant impact on the Brazilian economy.“
https://www.ecb.europa.eu/pub/pdf/other/eb201601_focus01.en.pdf?64a2cdbd9c4a9c254445668338164746
”Brazil's economy slumps to 25-year low
Brazil’s economy suffered its worst slump for quarter of a century last year as a global commodity rout, a domestic political crisis and rising inflation forced businesses to slash spending and jobs.
Brazil’s economy had been hit hard by a collapse in commodity and oil prices in the past two years, said Mihir Kapadia, head of Sun Global Investments, an emerging markets wealth management company in London.
“The situation has been made worse by the high debt levels, especially in foreign currency – essentially in US dollars. Problems of governance, corruption and political issues have created a perfect storm for continued political instability,” Kapadia added.
https://www. theguardian.com/business/2016/mar/03/brazil-economy-low-oil-prices-inflation
DemonTree
Dec 16th, 2018 - 12:26 am - Link - Report abuse 0Yea, I unfortunately mis-addressed my inquiry about your trip to Chile.
Jack
You're wasting your time debating crazy Terry, who I'm convinced lives with his mother somewhere in Canada.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0You have the effrontery to describe what JB does as debating? When I prove time and time again he is just a debased liar.
The only person who is crazy is one whom without any evidence makes deluded guesses as to where others live.
All this effort on behalf of person you have a perverse need to be sycophantic to.
If you're gonna be a smartass, first you have to be smart. Otherwise you're just an ass.
“One of the first businesses of a sensible man is to know when he is beaten, and to leave off” ...Samuel Butler
@JB
Dec 16th, 2018 - 02:42 am - Link - Report abuse 0I was pleased I got to see SP; the original flight plan had us going quite far to the west of it, but they must have changed it to avoid the storms. It was chucking it down in BA when we left, too. Really I was surprised how bad the weather was in BA, and how nice down in Patagonia, but I think we were lucky with the latter. It's a shame you've never been there, it was really cool and awe-inspiring, but I suppose there are lots of mountains and deserts in Brazil too. Maybe not glaciers though, since it's nearer the equator?
I went star-gazing while I was there; there are two galaxies which are only visible from the southern hemisphere, they were quite easy to see, and the southern cross is immediately identifiable. The only other constellation I could recognise was Orion, which was unsurprisingly upside down. It's kind of spooky looking up at the sky and seeing unfamiliar stars, and odd seeing the sun go anticlockwise round the sky. I wanted to see a back-to-front sundial, but no one seemed to have one.
“The 1st encourages it, the 2nd, others how to accept it.”
I still don't see much difference, but what does it matter? People might experiment, but they're not going to change their nature on a whim, and ignoring things doesn't make them go away anyway.
Re Terry, of course he's an idiot and probably pulled that price of gold thing out of his ass as a distraction after I proved him wrong. But his hypocrisy and basic lack of honesty bother me more. He's constantly going on about burden of proof and ad hominems, yet the very first thing he does when challenged is try and shift the BoP onto me and insult me. I don't care where he lives, but unless he's claiming to live in Brazil, my argument still stands, and he was wrong about MS anyway! I'd think if he did live in Br, he'd be able to speak some Portuguese rather than relying on a shitty google translation, but whatever. At least I'm honest enough to admit I don't live in Br and can't speak the language.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 09:35 am - Link - Report abuse 0Mea culpa it was that other lying fascist Chicureo aka “the prize troll“ not you.
So it should have been addressed to him. What mislead me is you both harked on as to where I live.
“after I proved him wrong.” You're seriously deluded or you'd be able to show where. “I don't care where he lives” you care enough to comment. After three times of asking another party that boat has sailed, failure to answer when asked is silence, and connotes an admission in favour of the party that asked the question.
@TH
Dec 16th, 2018 - 10:19 am - Link - Report abuse +1REF: “Problems of governance, corruption and political issues have created a perfect storm for continued political instability,” Kapadia added”:
Nice to know that Kapadia sounds extremely optimistic:
http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-1RhwTPbBMig/ThRX83Dj6nI/AAAAAAAABZg/q_UVIT04YDs/s1600/charge-sujeito.jpg
DemonTree
Dec 16th, 2018 - 11:37 am - Link - Report abuse 0Did you see the moon? It also appears “upside down” for visitors from the north.
(The Incas used a different system for organizing the stars as the dark areas devoid of stars represented animal forms. It's remarkable to gaze into the heavens on a clear night and discover.)
Regarding the fellow that lives with his mother in Canada... Amazingly there is solid evidence that the entire economic ressesion in Brazil was solely caused by a fluxciation in gold prices. It seems I had it all wrong blaming the economic problems due to outrageous fiscal mismanagement, high level government corruption and wholesale plundering of state opened assets, such as Petrobras. I see now see clearly that Brazil's problems indeed were solely a consequence of a fluxciation in gold prices. (Probably it's also the reason why Venezuela has been having problems as well.) ...Sigh, ...we all owe Terry an apology...
@Chicureo
Dec 16th, 2018 - 12:30 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Not really, the moon wasn't up when we drove out of El Chalten to look at the stars (and we had to wait until midnight because it's so close to the equinox there, we have the same problem with light skies in the UK in summer). Plus there wasn't too much moon to see most of the time, it was close to new. I did see it from the plane on the way back as a crescent lying flat on it's back. Guess it makes sense, if the moon is 'upside down' in the southern hemisphere, it must be sideways at the equator.
And I didn't know that about the Incas. Interesting way of looking at it. Which are the easiest to spot? And what did you think the first time you saw the night sky in the northern hemisphere?
As for Terry, JB asked him if he spoke Portuguese several times, and so did I, and he always refused to answer. According to him that's an admission in favour of us, but don't expect him to admit it. He pretends to be interested in evidence, but didn't even read those articles I linked to. I know it's pointless debating him but sometimes I can't resist.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 16th, 2018 - 01:48 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“What is driving Brazil’s economic downturn? The downturn of the non-energy commodity price cycle” according to the European Central Bank's economists. You better contact them and say their wrong as you know better.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
“He pretends to be interested in evidence” Well since I produce an abundance of facts to support my position, thats a remarkable pretence on my part. hahaha
@Terry the Liar
Dec 16th, 2018 - 02:03 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And yet you still haven't produced a single scrap of evidence for your assertion that the fall in gold prices precipitated a major meltdown of the commodities market in 2014. Hypocrite.
Do you live in Brazil, Terry Liar Hill?
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 16th, 2018 - 02:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Terry the Liar” No proof, no truth. Nice bit of sucking though.
Well it didn't occur after the fact, so it preceded and was also the first commodities downturn. Those are indisputable facts.
“You still haven't produced” It's not necessary as it stands on its own merits, due to its chronology as an argumentum a fortior.
I see you are confusing your interlocutors again. Please try and keep us straight, I don't think me and Chicureo are particularly similar in any way.
Dec 16th, 2018 - 02:36 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And now I see why you prefer to let others do your reasoning for you. That is the fallacy of post hoc ergo propter hoc, I suggest you look it up. Also, you did not answer my question about whether you live in Brazil. From your silence I am drawing the adverse inference that you do not, just as you said I should.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 03:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0You are remarkably similar in strivings using essentially failed arguments. So doesn't matter as your essentially interchangeable.
“That is the fallacy...” hardly since since it is a commodity that was the first in chronology to a take dive.
Your just attempting to revisit your implicit claim that gold is not commodity.
Personal matters stay just as that, I'm here to verify or dispute issues, not for a chit chat.
Good lord, Chicureo spends his time winding you up whereas I am always honest. If you can't tell the difference, you really do have problems.
Dec 16th, 2018 - 03:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0And saying that something happened first therefore it must have caused something else that happened later is exactly the post hoc fallacy. It doesn't matter how much time you spend reading about these things and how often you quote them if you don't understand a thing. Unless you're willing to learn you'll it's pointless.
And thanks for confirming you don't speak Portuguese or live in Brazil. We all knew already though.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 03:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“I am always honest” I see you've stepped on that rake head again and smacked yourself in head with the handle.
“Terry the Liar” No proof, no truth.“
”something happened first therefore it must have caused..is exactly” What ridiculous sophistry. No one can draw any conclusions as to economic activity, as it is all totally subjective. Absolute rubbish.
Like say I about personal musings, I neither confirm nor deny, so use what ever absurdities you wish in order to draw artificial conclusions.
DemonTree
Dec 16th, 2018 - 03:56 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Every naval cadet worldwide has obligatory extensive studies of celestial navigation. Seeing the first Northern Hemisphere clear sky of the stars for me was amazing. I've always been a fan of astronomy and have a modest telescope at home. A good introduction about the Inca culture: https://www.thoughtco.com/inca-star-worship-and-constellations-2136315
Regarding Brazil: If you analyze the price averages of commodities, which includes its top exports, Soybeans, Iron Ore, Raw Sugar, Crude Petroleum and the plethora of other highly sought after goods, there is absolutely no reasonable logic to justify a severe recession. It's actually the opposite! Just examining the sad case of Petrobras clearly exhibits the thievery.
Rampant outrageous treasury mismanagement and wide-scale corruption by many of Brazil's governance (by almost all political parties) seems to be most likely why the country is in difficulty.
Then again, perhaps the boy who lives with his mother in Canada should take Jack's suggestion to visit Lula for an intimate visit with Lula...
@Chicureo
Dec 16th, 2018 - 04:33 pm - Link - Report abuse 0REF: ”Rampant outrageous treasury mismanagement and wide-scale corruption by many of Brazil's governance (by almost all political parties) seems to be most likely why the country is in difficulty”:
You really can't blame the crooks for stealing; after so willingly and even somewhat eagerly, handing over the keys of the safe to the crooks!
Aren't the Brazilians responsible for granting benefits, special privileges & protection against laws to the crooks; in spite of knowing that they ARE the crooks?
https://i1.wp.com/humorpolitico.com.br/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/OLIVEIRA-050915-Face-519x420.jpg?resize=519%2C420
:o))
Dec 16th, 2018 - 04:45 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I was just pointing out to the “adolescent who lives with his mother in Canada” that commodity prices had nothing to do with why Petrobras was put nearly into bankruptcy. There's an old Chilean saying about “...not blaming pigs for acting like pigs...”
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 05:01 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“I am always honest” I see you've stepped on that rake head again and smacked yourself in the face with the handle.
“Terry the Liar” No proof, no truth.“
”Something happened first therefore it must have caused..is exactly” What ridiculous sophistry. No one can draw any conclusions as to economic activity, as it is all totally subjective. Absolute rubbish.
Like say I about personal musings, I neither confirm nor deny, so use what ever absurdities you wish in order to draw artificial conclusions.
DemonTree
Dec 16th, 2018 - 05:43 pm - Link - Report abuse 0It's amazing that perhaps one of the most common phrases of a mendacious individual is: “I am always honest”... “I am always honest”...“I am always honest”
(This alone exhibits plenty of circumstantial evidence the boy is a duplicitous idiot.)
I suspect out adolescent that lives with his mother in Canada has often stepped on a rake head, smacking himself repeatedly in the face with the handle too many times resulting in his severe brain impairment.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Dec 16th, 2018 - 05:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Chicureo spends his time winding you up” Such activity serves him well, as he always appears in a much better light afterwards. hahaha
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
The issue is did the commodities crash impact Brazil economically? As all unbiased economic experts I have shown give resounding yes. So you further engage, in your dishonest practise of moving the goal-posts. All mentions of Petrobras by economic experts have been of a peripheral capacity, not a primary one.
I see you're giving your Oedipus complex another airing. Unfortunately for you, it's not transferable to others, you're stuck with it, deal with it.
“It's amazing that perhaps one of the most common phrases of a mendacious individual...” The only posters that have proffered their honesty or called another dishonest is DT, JB and yourself.
I would agree that you are all mendacious.
Despite our adolescent that lives with his mother in Canada spewing ridiculous excuses why his hero Lula is unjustly incarcerated in prison. Undeniable factual truth clearly demonstrate why the governors of the PT (and other politicians) are overwhelmingly guilty of criminally looting the national wealth.
Dec 16th, 2018 - 06:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0But, hey... Maybe Lula is innocent and 73% of the Brazilian public* has the wrong perception of why Brazil has economic difficulties...
(*according to a recent published national poll)
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 16th, 2018 - 07:21 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Psst your Oedipus complex is showing again. “Undeniable factual truth clearly demonstrate” of which you are unable to provide any proof of. “has the wrong perception of why...” It isn't rocket science 65% of federal politicans
have been indicted or accused of corruption, including the president elect. The press oligarchy opinion favours the status quo. As well as illegally using social media transmitting propaganda millions of fake news messages. It is not surprising that if even true 73% of the Brazilian public according to a recent uncited national poll
national poll)...may.
@DT
Dec 16th, 2018 - 08:49 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Nope, no glaciers in Brazil -(hope Terry doesn't demand I prove that) - the Southern Star and Orion are quite easy to see on a clear night, but wasn't aware Orion was upside down.
“odd seeing the sun go anticlockwise round the sky” (???) anticlockwise, in the southern hemisphere....presumably clockwise in the northern hemisphere ? never really gave it much thought, but I presume that clockwise/ anticlockwise reference is due to the relative position of East 'n West in relation to the Equator, as seen fm both hemispheres ?
”“The 1st encourages it, the 2nd, others how to accept it.” basically, in this particular matter, it shouldn't even BE necessary to teach what is ok and what isn't.....it's what I've said before, if people were to mind their own business, and minorities did not make a point of rubbing their preferences in other people's faces, it would just be a fact of life and no one would single out eventual differences to compain or protest about. Quite frankly, people are going to be what they are, and given the generalized, open 'intolerance' (by some majority, or minority groups) is why I said “tolerance”. Maybe we should be nicer to Terry ? and stop fooling him ?
If not mistaken, idiot Terry has in the past, claimed to have lived in Brazil, in Canada, yet he refuses to confirm either ....is he so paranoid that he thinks someone will track him down and show him for the piece of crap he is ?
Why is that when u read Terry's crap, you feel you've read the SOS a 1,000 times before ? because it always IS the same crap....demanding B of P from others, which does not apply to him, denying the obvious, telling lies and then contradicting what he's just said in order to create confusion and lose track of those lies.
Rgdng Lula 'n Dilma if we had all only known that the 2014 crisis in Brazil had been caused by the drop in the price of gold, “one of Brazil's largest exports”, we could've avoided all this, and the 'toad' would not be rotting in Curitiba.
Jack,
Dec 16th, 2018 - 09:08 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Yes, In my country, if we screw up our COPPER industry we will as well cause our downfall. Venezuela did screw up on its PETROLEUM industry and your country really mismanaged your GOLD mining industry, which is clearly the reason for why the “toad” is rotting in Curitiba. Makes sense... he claims he's an expert...
...It's very confusing to follow our Marxist mentally challenged adolescent that lives with his mother in Canada who's now admitting that Lula da Silva is in fact guilty, but he argues that it's perfectly normal in Brazil for the majority of politicians to be guilty of criminal activities.
As he's repeatedly reminded us, “I am always honest”... “I am always honest”...“I am always honest”
@Chicureo
Dec 16th, 2018 - 09:13 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“Every naval cadet worldwide has obligatory extensive studies of celestial navigation.”
Makes sense. I bet they don't all enjoy it though. You should have been able to find the plough and pole star easily enough, and Cassiopeia (the W) is easy to spot and always visible from the UK. Cygnus looks like a T and the Milky Way runs between them, but sadly there's too much light pollution in most of the UK to see it. I always wanted to see another galaxy, and I've tried to find Andromeda several times, but it's really not visible to the naked eye. The Magellanic Clouds were easy to see, although they don't look like much if you don't know what they are. We did have a star map that listed constellations, but none really stood out to me except the Southern Cross. Maybe it looked so familiar and obvious because I've seen it on so many flags?
Do you know how to find the south celestial pole from the Southern Cross? I've heard there's a way, but it sounded complicated so I didn't bother. Besides, from El Chalten in December just as the UK in June you can roughly tell direction by the glow of the sun just below the horizon that never disappears.
If the place Think lives is anything like the ones we visited then I envy him. It was even nice being all snug in the cabin with the wind rattling round outside.
As for Brazil, from what I have heard there are many reasons for the severe recession, the corruption investigations that have paralysed work among them. I don't expect anything Terry says to have any bearing on reality, I merely find his hypocrisy annoying.
“It's amazing that perhaps one of the most common phrases of a mendacious individual is: “I am always honest””
Are you calling me a liar?
@Terry the Liar
First you make a claim, then you say it's all totally subjective. Just admit you were wrong.
JB
Dec 16th, 2018 - 10:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0What are you a nitwit or a halfwit? Must be the latter as you're too big an idiot to be the former.
“Is he so paranoid that he thinks...” Not at as I was referred to by my peers as the 'local legend' the only one so titled out of 140,000. So nobody is going show me anything, 'cause if anybody is doing any showing, it'll be me. As to why, I don't give it a second thought, it just the choice I made. Since I've been online since '95, and it works for me. It's not broken, therefore it doesn't need fixing. Nor do care, what other people do with their personal information, as its none of my business.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Psst your Oedipus complex is showing again. You should keep your personal preferences private. Otherwise, you'll be viewed as a motherfcuker. “Who's now admitting that Lula da Silva is in fact guilty”. No proof, no truth.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
“Terry the Liar” makes your claim of “I am always honest” obviously untrue, otherwise you'd be able to prove it.
“Then you say it's all totally subjective.” You're a God dammed liar. What I said was in reference to what you were trying to shoe-horn into the equation, the clue is 'rubbish' plonker.
@DT, Chicureo
Dec 16th, 2018 - 10:29 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Terry's question “The issue is did the commodities crash impact Brazil economically?” never WAS the question....he now tries to tergiversate and disown his lies....the origin of all this was Terry's denial of Chicureo's statement that Lula was responsible for Brazil's 2014 crisis....which suddenly became about the commodity crash, which then became the gold 'crash'....which then made Lula innocent..
This time, after regally crapping himself, and realizing his arguments aren't lie-proof, Terry admitted his claims are totally subjective...“No one can draw any conclusions as to economic activity, as it is all totally subjective. .” That's a 180° swing in the other direction to all his previous claims on the matter......while certain events do allow a 'bit' of leeway in the interpretation of the effects they may have on the economy, that is as far as 'subjectivity' goes. The causes of such events are not at all subjective...they are easy to pinpoint, especially when analyzed in hindsight.....
But why bother, we all know that the drop in the price of gold, our “main” commodity, caused Brazil's recession. Thanks to Terry. He has saved us all so much time.
@JB
Dec 16th, 2018 - 10:35 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“wasn't aware Orion was upside down”
To the Greeks who named it it would be. From El Chaltén I saw the sword sticking up in the air from the belt - perhaps it's a presidential sash instead - and the red star Betelgeuse at the bottom where normally it's at the top. Otherwise it looked much the same. And yes, clockwise is exactly the direction the shadow moves around a sundial in the northern hemisphere, where clocks were invented. A sundial in Argentina would need the numbers going anti-clockwise, but I never saw one. In both cases the sun rises in the east and sets in the west, but in the NH generally it goes round to the south and in the SH to the north. However, since SP is near the tropics it probably seems to go straight overhead to you. That's far from the case here. On my birthday the sun reaches a paltry 13.5° above the horizon, then quickly sets again. Even on the summer solstice it only gets to 60.5°. Europe is REALLY far north.
“if people were to mind their own business”
That's too optimistic. People love to judge others for whatever reasons they can come up with. Sexual orientation is ceasing to be one in many countries, thought not Brazil, but it'll just be replaced by others. Hence why I think schools should teach tolerance and not the opposite. It's an aspiration that can't be reached, but still an improvement. And there's a fine line between not “rubbing your preferences in other people's faces” and lying/deceiving others. I don't know where it is.
As for Terry, perhaps we should be nicer to him. But... his stupidity isn't his fault, but his arrogance and offensiveness is. He insulted me for months before I returned it in kind - guess my tolerance ran out ;) I feel sorry for him really, he obviously has an interest in logic etc but no ability for it, and that is pretty sad.
DemonTree
Dec 16th, 2018 - 11:10 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Ah, the stars...
...my first introductory class in celestial navigation fascinated me from the first lecture. We studied history about how the Phoenicians, Greeks, Vikings, Magellan. and Drake used crude instruments to accurately navigate the seas. Then, an Englishman invented the marine chronometer solving the problem of calculating longitude while at sea. I've been hooked ever since.
One year after receiving my commission, I mentioned casually to my young bride that I was planning to buy a telescope and she threatened ominously against the expensive frivolity. (She had already had her cousin purchase one earlier in France as a surprise... somehow she's somehow remained tolerant of my excessive “frivolities” throughout our partnership.)
As you probably know, Chile has some of the best observational places on earth, especially in higher altitudes in the Northern desert. There you can see the “dark” figures the Incas saw. Another great link is: https://www.thoughtco.com/inca-star-worship-and-constellations-2136315
There are at least three ways to find the faint star Sigma Octantis, but weather always almost makes it difficult at sea. (What's absolutely impossible to view in any hemisphere is the excessively dim representation of a star Oedipus Tyrannus. In pig-latin commonly known as “Terry”)
Jack
Be very careful, the “adolescent who cohabits with his mother in Canada” is peer erected as a certifiable “local legend” of only one so titled out of 140,000 idiots posting since 1995! Be very very careful, you've been warned.
Señor “I am always honest” has conclusively proven to us all that we were half-wits not to see the clear linkage of GOLD mining to Brazil's economic recession.
“Mine cup runneth over” with Carmenère... “She who must be obeyed” soon “preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil...” Roasted lamb this evening with asparagus.
What a joyous early evening!
That does sound interesting. Of course latitude is an absolute measure defined by the spinning of the earth - you could never place the equator and poles anywhere else - whereas longitude is essentially arbitrary, so not surprising it's harder to measure. The zero meridian could have been placed through Paris or Berlin or Santiago, but London is pretty convenient since it puts the international date line in the middle of the Pacific. We have a real advanage when it comes to business hours too, since the UK overlaps with most other countries.
Dec 16th, 2018 - 11:44 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Your wife must have known you pretty well if she had to warn you off buying something because she'd already got it as a gift. Have you seen the comet that's supposed to be visible with a telescope tonight? And yeah, i know there are a bunch of big telescopes in Chile. You have the advantage of clear skies and little light pollution, not something we enjoy here, but I did manage to see the old familiar constellations last night, as it was clear when we got home. It's much better since they started turning the streetlights off at midnight to save money, but nearly everyone else seems to object.
I wonder if any of the 'dark' constellations are visible from this latitude? Shame I didn't know about them while I was there, but TBH I had trouble even seeing the milky way because of the summer glow in the sky. Probably would be a lot better for star gazing in Feb or March, and no need to stay up till midnight, either.
Anyway, unlike you I've already had my tea and really ought to get to bed. Unfortunately despite my efforts my body still seems to stuck in your timezone. :(
JB
Dec 17th, 2018 - 12:11 am - Link - Report abuse 0The issue is did the commodities crash impact Brazil economically?never WAS the question....
Oh yes it was as you raised it on this thread as quote mine “nobody saw it coming
http://en.mercopress.com/2018/12/08/lula-tells-bbc-why-he-was-jailed-to-prevent-him-from-winning-the-presidential-election/comments#comment495594
”Chicureo's statement that Lula was responsible for Brazil's 2014 crisis“ Was not addressed to me nor did I respond to it so your liar.
”Terry admitted his claims are totally subjective..“No I didn't you lying moron I responded to DT's claim
With the derisive ”What ridiculous sophistry. No one can draw any conclusions as to economic activity, as it is all totally subjective. Absolute rubbish.“
Do try and keep up with subject matter at hand, unless you enjoy being viewed as a gormless loon.
DemonTree the slavish follower aka The Appendage
Don't worry about me I'm light years ahead of you. Your not first the troll I've dealt with, nor will you be the last.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
You're professing your Oedipus fixation again. Careful, folks will conclude your a motherfcuker.
”linkage of GOLD mining to Brazil's economic...”
Psst don't know how to break it to you but gold is a commodity
The Most Actively Traded Commodities
Crude Oil.
Natural Gas.
Heating Oil.
Sugar - World #11.
RBOB Gasoline.
Gold.
Corn.
Wheat.
More items...•Aug 22, 2018
The Most Actively Traded Commodities - The Balance
https://www. thebalance.com/the-most-actively-traded-commodities-809314
Jack,
Dec 17th, 2018 - 01:13 am - Link - Report abuse 0Foolish me, I'm confused again. I somehow wrongly assumed mining GOLD ore and refining into metal bars would produce a product to market as a “commodity” but our ”peer erected as a certifiable local legend* (of only one so titled out of 140,000 idiots) points out that he's unfortunately forgotten to mention that Brazil's most valuable exported products are soya beans followed by iron ores and concentrates, sugar, crude oil and a whole lot of other stuff. Oh my...
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 17th, 2018 - 01:31 am - Link - Report abuse 0“Brazil's most valuable exported products..” What relevance does that have to issue at hand?
Nothing at all so you can stop moving the goal-posts. How long have you had these mother fixations?
Jack
Dec 17th, 2018 - 02:05 am - Link - Report abuse 0I forgot to mention that the “adolescent who cohabits with his mother in Canada” (peer erected as a certifiable “local legend” of only one so titled out of 140,000 idiots) would appreciate you arranging for him to have a conjugal visit with the criminally convicted “toad” currently rotting in prison. Let's help him achieve this.
All that glitters is not always gold, often you have heard that told. Big soya farming operations are bold, as they are the real producers of Brazilian gold.
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 17th, 2018 - 11:39 am - Link - Report abuse 0I forgot to mention the motherfcuker that bravely flaunts his anonymous keyboard status over the mountains standing 10 ft above sea level enjoying the ever changing vista of green, to amber, then to red, and back to green again.
“All that glitters is not always gold” But the most important aspect is that they're all commodities.
@Chicureo
Dec 17th, 2018 - 12:51 pm - Link - Report abuse 0REF: old Chilean saying about “...not blaming pigs for acting like pigs...”
Looks like a similar saying in Brazil; is to “WORSHIP” and NOT to blame them!
@TH
Dec 17th, 2018 - 01:52 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Who cares whether your 'peers' elected you the 'local idiot', or the 'local bicycle', it's always about 'you, you, you', isn't it you envious little dick ?
Liked “So nobody is going show me anything, 'cause if anybody is doing any showing, it'll be me”.......well then, what are you planning on showing Lula when you visit him ? perhaps he'll give you some “João de Deus” treatment, B4 cuddling up behind you. You will wake up cured !
“ “Then you say it's all totally subjective.” You're a God dammed liar. What I said was in reference to...blah,blah, blah...” just confirms what I wrote above....deny it, try to wiggle out of it....No use numb nuts, it's all there, right above, for anyone to see.
@DT
“That's too optimistic”...with the great majority of “idiots” who crowd this planet, I'm forced to agree....but it has to start sometime...and isn't your “Hence why I think schools should teach 'tolerance' and not the opposite”, just what I was saying ? plus, teach them to mind their own business....everyone could be happier.
Re TH, “he obviously has an interest in logic etc but no ability for it, and that is pretty sad”.....well, as we both agreed earlier on, not everyone is cut out to study....Terry should never have stopped cleaning lavatories....he was so succesfull...he even showed us his comemorative tankard for his promtion, for 3 years loyal service in the bogs.
@Chicureo
Thanks for opening my eyes to that veiled threat fm Terry.....If I don't watch myself, 140,000 morons will descend upon me, shouting “Terry is the greatest”, until I kneel 'n beg for peace.
Regarding the 'gold' crash, I am so relieved he mentioned it....at least now, when I talk to my friends, I'll avoid committing the gaffe of saying Lula caused the 2014 crisis.
But just a minute, you've just given Terry the perfect excuse - he'll now say he meant soya beans when he referred to Brazil's gold..
Can see he's lost it...the unintelligible babble 'n all the swearing....
Jack Bauer aka Proof-less and Truth-less
Dec 17th, 2018 - 02:38 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BJ “is he so paranoid...” TH “No, as my sobriquet was the 'local legend' DT ”Who cares ..it's always about 'you.“ Not at all, if if you don't like the answer don't ask the question, stupid.
”Then you say it's all totally subjective.” You are a liar, already answered in full. I did not.
http://en.mercopress.com/2018/12/08/lula-tells-bbc-why-he-was-jailed-to-prevent-him-from-winning-the-presidential-election/comments#comment495793
You must have had a terrible time in the reservists pioneer corp from your obsession with 'lavatories'. I guess your serving colleges didn't appreciate what a gift to the world you where, and kept cleaning them with your head. Military is great, it soon sorts out the men from the boys.
Yeah, the great commodities crash will do it every time, it's the elephant in the room.
TH
Dec 17th, 2018 - 03:40 pm - Link - Report abuse 0????????????????????????????????? what, Numb nuts, or should I refer to you as the 'local idiot'....as your 'peers' did ? they were just trying to make you happy, can't you see ?Sorry for popping your balloon.
Right, the military are great.....then why are you so afraid of the Brazilian Military ?.....did they by any chance treat you badly (when/IF you lived here) ? poor, little thing...
Jack Bauer aka Proof-less and Truth-less
Dec 17th, 2018 - 04:04 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BJ “is he so paranoid...” TH “No, as my sobriquet was the 'local legend' DT ”Who cares ..it's always about 'you.“ Not at all, if if you don't like the answer don't ask the question, stupid.
”Then you say it's all totally subjective.” You are a liar, already answered in full. I did not.
http://en.mercopress.com/2018/12/08/lula-tells-bbc-why-he-was-jailed-to-prevent-him-from-winning-the-presidential-election/comments#comment495793
You must have had a terrible time in the reservists pioneer corp from your obsession with 'lavatories'. I guess your serving colleges didn't appreciate what a gift to the world you where, and kept cleaning them with your head. Military is great, it soon sorts out the men from the boys.
Yeah, the great commodities crash will do it every time, it's the elephant in the room.
Jack Bauer
Dec 17th, 2018 - 04:22 pm - Link - Report abuse 0First, we all should show respect and deference in using which soubriquet the pompous liar prefers:
1. The pretentious peer erected as a certifiable local legend* (of only one so titled out of 140,000 idiots)
2. The sententious and mendacious “I am always honest”...“I am always honest”
3. The arrogant conceited Canadian who cohabits with his mother.
4. “Nobody is going show me anything”, cause if anybody is doing any showing.“
5. ”Been online since '95, and it works for me. It's not broken, therefore it doesn't need fixing.”
...So many choices...
Jack Bauer aka Proof-less and Truth-less
Dec 17th, 2018 - 04:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0BJ “is he so paranoid...” TH “No, as my sobriquet was the 'local legend' DT ”Who cares ..it's always about 'you.“ Not at all, if if you don't like the answer don't ask the question, stupid.
”Then you say it's all totally subjective.” You are a liar, already answered in full. I did not.
http://en.mercopress.com/2018/12/08/lula-tells-bbc-why-he-was-jailed-to-prevent-him-from-winning-the-presidential-election/comments#comment495793
You must have had a terrible time in the reservists pioneer corp from your obsession with 'lavatories'. I guess your serving colleges didn't appreciate what a gift to the world you where, and kept cleaning them with your head. Military is great, it soon sorts out the men from the boys.
Yeah, the great commodities crash will do it every time, it's the elephant in the room.
Jack Babar
Dec 17th, 2018 - 05:12 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Be careful, there are actually imported ELEPHANTS living in Brazil, so one of them could possibly be lurking menacingly in a commodities trading room focused on GOLD (or golden SOYA) so be very very careful on how you respond. Remember, he's a “certifiable local legend”...
I certainly hope the “room” the elephant resides is rather large, because Elephants are known to be claustrophobic... My goodness, you don't think Terry has left an elephant unattended in a room somewhere, not telling what might happen INCLUDING causing some sort of disruption to the GOLD commodity trading floor!
...it could perhaps collapse the entire Brazilian economy... Oh my...
Then it could be that the “elephant in the room” is just a stuffed Babar the elephant stuffed toy, so what was he really inferring? Perhaps he's again forgotten to take his meds...
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 17th, 2018 - 05:17 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I forgot to mention the motherfcuker that bravely flaunts his anonymous keyboard status.
“liar prefers” No proof, no truth. Just confirmation of a reactionary at work.
“I am always honest” Which if it wasn't true then you'd be able to refute it, but you can't.
Jack Bauer aka Proof-less and Truth-less
“or should I refer to you..” I see you managed to remove your head from the w.c, I don't believe sticking it up your ass is an improvement.
“Then why are you so afraid of the Brazilian Military ?...” I am not pillock.
As an apprentice after my first semester, we moved living quarters, and were integrated with the rest of the squadron. When we arrived senior members told us to prepare for an initiation of humiliation and bullying. The rest of my entry meekly submitted. I told them I wouldn't and I'd fight any of them who came near me. I was left alone. I thus reconfirmed an adage, that real tough guys are never bullies, they have no need to prove anything.
Jack Babar
Dec 17th, 2018 - 06:00 pm - Link - Report abuse 0I find his latest ranting missive confusingly borderline homophobic with a militaristic envy distorted vision that could be the consequence of cohabiting in a matriarchal dominated Canadian home. Wintertime in a place like Winnipeg must be extreemly dreary anyway and perhaps he's suffering while clinging to his “anonymous” keyboard. I'm however bemused with his declaration: “I am always honest which if it wasn't true then you'd be able to refute it, but you can't.”
The closest he ever got close to military training was playing with his Lego figurine toys. (They make a fantastic pirate ship!)
Is “the elephant in the room” he refers to a stuffed Babar toy, or he is just off his meds again? Maybe he could send a Babar the King of the Elephants toy to Lula who's still rotting in a prison cell. It could cheer up the old toad, don't you think?
Chicureo aka “the prize troll“
Dec 17th, 2018 - 06:24 pm - Link - Report abuse 0Have we got to suffer your Oedipus fixation again” Why don't you come clean and cough that fur ball up.
Then perhaps you'll stop boring us with your unnatural sexual attraction for your mother. I know that confession is good for the soul, but you need professional help, and it doesn't benefit us in anyway that you're a wacko.
@JB
Dec 17th, 2018 - 09:37 pm - Link - Report abuse 0“isn't you... just what I was saying ?”
I did say I didn't see much difference. We don't tolerate things that really hurt other people, after all. But evangelicals are against tolerance, they think everyone should follow their religion and act like them, and in the US their aim is to take over and use the law to force everyone to follow their rules. A bit like Muslims with sharia, really, and both want to ban teaching certain science because it disagrees with their religions.
Don't suppose you kept track of where you posted your replies to me while I was away, did you? I've been trying to go back and find them but I've only discovered a couple.
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